The Real Science Of Female Arousal

Kevin Anthony 0:05
Welcome to the Love Lab podcast, a safe and fun place to get real and learn about sex. Whether you’re a man or woman, single or couple, this is the show for you. I am your host, Kevin Anthony, and I am here to guide you to go from good to amazing in the bedroom, and your relationships.

Welcome back to the Love Lab podcast. This is episode 292 and it’s titled The real science behind female arousal with Dr. Harun Padma Nathan. Now, I know if you’re a longtime listener of the show, you might be thinking, That sounds familiar. Didn’t you already do an episode on the science behind female arousal? Yes, I did. But today’s is going to be different. So in the previous episode, I had a woman on Pamela Madsen. And she had worked with the university where they were basically using questionnaires to ask women about their arousal. And there were actually some really valuable things that were learned from women about what they need in order to be aroused. And I use the term science because they actually did a scientific study on this. People, for some reason, seemed to think that that wasn’t real science. So I now have somebody who is an absolute expert in science, like the science, the actual physical medical science behind female arousal. So if you don’t get what you’re looking for, in this episode, I don’t know what to tell you. Because I think, I think we’re gonna get pretty deep into female arousal, how it works, where it goes wrong, what can be done about it, some new innovative solutions for it. So that’s what we’re gonna be talking about today.

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Okay, my guest today is Dr. Harin Padma Nathan. He is a Professor of Urology and lead investigator and consultant for Viagra and Cialis and is now co-founder of the Femtech company, Vella Bioscience, welcome to the show, Dr. Harin.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 2:46
Hi, Kevin. Nice to be on. Thank you.

Kevin Anthony 2:49
Okay, so we’re gonna dive pretty deep here into basically the science of arousal. But before we do that, I’m wondering, I mean, your bio kind of gives a clue as to what your background is. But I’m wondering if you could tell the audience a little bit more about what your background is in studying human sexual arousal.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 3:11
Sure, thanks for the question. My background is in smooth muscle physiology and pharmacology. originally applied to the development of Viagra Cialis, Levitra, Muse, kava Jack, things for male arousal. So arousal in men is in both genders. It’s a blood flow event, and separate from desire which is a complex brain event if you will. And arousal in women is also a pelvic event and both men and women are when they are aroused. The smooth muscle either in the penis or in the clitoris in the wall of the vagina relax, and that produces blood flow in men, it’s an erection, and in women, it’s lubrication in gorge movement and a slight erection of the clitoris as well. So my research originally was involved in developing drugs for ED, we’re now focused at Vella Bioscience on female sexual arousal.

Kevin Anthony 4:18
Great, thank you for that description, because I think that really sets the stage for everything that we’re going to talk about now. So you know, if you’re listening realize this is one of the top guys who has been studying how this works in both men and women. Okay, so you mentioned a little bit of the differences, the similarities, actually, and the differences between male and female sexual arousal. I’m curious, what made you switch from studying male arousal to female arousal?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 4:47
That’s a good question. And part of that is market-driven. There are so many drugs out there that are effective particularly a class of drugs called PDE. Five inhibitors, you know them as Viagra, Cialis. In Vitro for men, there really wasn’t an opportunity to continue doing a large amount of clinical drug development for men, driven by a market that was met, if you will. In women, there’s a huge unmet need there are no drugs or other prescription medication for female sexual arousal problems. There are four desire problems Molesey as an example, but not for the arousal of women. And so, Avella bioscience, we decided we wanted to approach this from a nutraceutical or a non-pharmaceutical approach, but we also have some pharmaceutical aspects that are in play in a separate company.

Kevin Anthony 5:47
So I’m curious, about you because that’s a great answer. And that makes total sense, right? Like the market is saturated for men. But there’s a huge demand over here on the side for women that’s not being met. That makes complete sense. I’m curious if you have any stats on this current state of wonder like how many women are experiencing a lack of arousal or difficulty getting arousal, that sort of thing?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 6:12
So I think arousal problems have been well-studied in arousal dysfunction. For example, post-SSRI antidepressant treatment, but large population studies have sort of asked the question, are you satisfied with you know, desire, arousal, orgasm? Are you satisfied with their sex life? Shiffrin and other researchers have reported that, as we as women age, the prevalence of sexual this fattest faction, maybe sexual dysfunctions are not different from what we saw in men. After the age of 45, nearly a third to a half of women complain of dissatisfaction with sexual activity, including arousal. So it’s a large market, similar to what we saw with Ed and men over the age of 45.

Kevin Anthony 7:04
Let’s see, I think that’s really interesting because I don’t think a lot of people really think about it from the women’s perspective, like, you know, there’s so much talk in media and you know, even in you know, shows or in the realms that you know, I work about men’s sexual dysfunction, we hear about it all the time. But yet, we don’t hear much about women’s sexual dysfunction. And what you’re telling me is that there’s basically a relatively equal percentage of women that suffer from women’s sexual dysfunction as men.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 7:36
Right. And, I mean, I was talking about the numbers in women over 45. But it also exists in women under 45, particularly if they’re taking any depressant therapies. And part of that is maybe the fact that there aren’t drugs for it. Thus, there is a huge unmet need, but I think the discussion particularly around menopause, and sexual dysfunction is really growing. And as we know, there are there is increasing investment in female sexual wellness. Now we look at wellness as enhancing function that exists as opposed to treating a dysfunction, and Avella bioscience we’re, we’ve, we study arousal in a very scientific manner, to develop products that are effective for enhancing arousal. We haven’t studied and they’re not we don’t make claims about treating sexual dysfunction. However, we did discover that some of the molecules that we were interested in can when applied topically potentially treat SSRI or antidepressant-related sexual dysfunction. We spun out a second company, Otero Medical to address that, but Vela Bioscience is purely focused on enhancing function and in wellness, not in treating sexual dysfunctions.

Kevin Anthony 8:54
Yeah, that’s important that you make that clear. And yet at the same time, you know, when you ask a woman, you know, about what challenges she’s having, you know, she doesn’t necessarily care if it’s classified as a dysfunction, or just, you know, a low libido or low, you know, ability to get her out. All she’s really concerned about is how do I fix this?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 9:17
And it is, it’s part of a spectrum. You’re absolutely right, you know, to go from wellness to dysfunction is a part of the spectrum.

Kevin Anthony 9:31
I like the fact that, you talked about the fact that they are, and you’ve spun off separate companies to work on some of the more pharmaceutical things, but I love the focus here of Vela, which is really from the nutraceutical point of view. And I really I definitely want to talk more about that in a little bit because I’m really interested in what you’re doing with nutraceuticals and how that all works. But before we get there I just thought I wanted to talk a little bit more about the differences between, say men’s and women’s erection. So, or arousal. Sorry, could you describe how a woman’s arousal works? Like what’s the mechanism? How does this happen?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 10:20
When you are when you have desire, or otherwise stimulated sexually, in an intimate situation, an impulse goes from the brain down to a neurological impulse down to the erectile tissue, whether it’s in men or women and women. It’s the smooth muscle the involuntary muscle in the clitoris, because the clitoris can get semi-erect, and enlargement of the bowl Hall, which includes the labia menorah, and the wall of the vagina, that relaxation, the muscle that’s blood flow in and you get engagement but also results in something called transmutation, which is the essentially the leakage of serum into the, into the vaginal vault, creating lubrication. So the hallmark of arousal and men has an erection and for women, it’s engorgement of the genitalia, and lubrication of the vagina, which facilitates and promotes orgasm. So that’s arousal in a nutshell.

Kevin Anthony 11:22
That was a great description, really to the point really easy to understand. So thank you for that. So when it comes to female arousal, then at what part in that process, does it tend to go wrong?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 11:38
Well, if we’re talking about diseases or disorders, it’s a multifactorial event. So it could be a neurological problem, it could be a vascular problem. And it could be that the muscle is just not working or degenerating with age problems. Or it could be that the hormonal milieu of menopause is diminishing the function of the smooth muscle or accelerating atherosclerosis and the arteries that are delivering blood. But that’s dysfunction. I mean, arousal may, in a spectrum may diminish with age from a multitude of factors, not necessarily to meet a definition of dysfunction. But still, as you pointed out, to cause distress, and for women to seek some help. And there are options actually to enhance female sexual arousal that is, I don’t know if nutraceutical is the right word, but we can certainly go into what our basic science research and clinical science research was that helped us develop what we call Pleasure Serum, which is a serum of cannabidiol in lysosomes. And we can talk we’ll talk about that.

Kevin Anthony 12:53
Oh, yeah, we will definitely get to that, because I’m interested in that product and how it works. You mentioned that, okay, if it’s not dysfunction, right, as short of that, there are a multitude of factors, could you just give a few examples of what some of those might be?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 13:08
Well, I mean, there are the psychological ones, relationship issues, lack of desire that or lack of success and having orgasms, it’s well known that, you know, men are linear, they go from an interest, erection or has an ejaculation, women are not so linear in their sexual response cycle, and desire may not be present. But if you can have an orgasm, desire may increase. Secondarily, the things that go wrong are hormones, blood flow, and organ, you know, aging effects. And those are the primary critical ones in impacting arousal.

Kevin Anthony 13:49
Okay, so I think that does a really good job of laying the groundwork of what we’re talking about what we’re dealing with how the mechanism works within the female body, what types of things can potentially get in the way. So let’s talk now a little bit about basically what you can do about it. And that says, This is where your product is going to come in. But there may be some other things too. So from your perspective, when a woman is dealing with low sexual arousal, what are some of the things that she can do to shift that?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 14:22
Sure. You know, I mean, arousal is not the handle. Its arousal facilitates orgasm, and oftentimes, women complain about not having an orgasm. Rarely do they say, well, it’s a lubrication problem, but I can orgasm, right? So they go hand in hand, and there are things that you want to maybe ask your physician to check out your hormone level, particularly estradiol, and whether you’re pairing menopausal, but at the end of the day, if the hormone status is normal, there’s very little that medicine has to offer as a form of support As far as pharmaceutical treatments for arousal problems, but there are options as I’m, as we discussed before that are non-pharmaceutical.

Kevin Anthony 15:11
Well, let’s talk about some of those, what are those options?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 15:14
So, you know, there’s a plethora of products out there that claim benefit for women whether it’s arousal or orgasm. And none of them virtually none of them have had any scientific testing. So if you look at what happened during the pandemic, there were a lot of wellness and self-care products, including sexual wellness products that came out. And they were placed in kind of marketed like beauty products, you know, a promise with no data, what we’ve done at Vella Biosciences completely brings science into the development and data that we can provide to women on whether we have a product that would work for you and what the probability of success would be. So we went back and we used the same things that we used in developing things like Viagra, we studied a number of different compounds, including a lot of cannabinoids that are not psychoactive meaning don’t get you high. And cannabidiol, or CBD was one of those molecules. We’ve also studied sildenafil, or what is the brand name Viagra. But it’s a pharmaceutical, we’ve studied a number of molecules and their ability to relax vaginal smooth muscle.

And if we see what’s called a dose-response, where small, increasing amounts of the molecule we’re interested in will produce increasing relaxation of that vaginal, smooth muscle, we know we have a product that will have an effect. The issue with CBD or cannabidiol is that it’s highly lipophilic, meaning it’s fat-friendly, and doesn’t really go beyond the surface when you apply it topically. And so we in our pleasure serum have encapsulated it in what is called liposomal, or nano encapsulations that make it water soluble, and deliver our CBD actively to that smooth muscle to get a real effect, which you won’t see by applying oils to topically, this is a very sophisticated nanoencapsulation and serum and those liposomal has also conferred the ability to be common compatible, we’ve done third-party testing, and that we think if you have a product for sexual enhancement, you’ve got to also facilitate a safe sexual activity that is being able to use a condom.

And we have done clinical studies, including looking at blood flow in what’s called vaginal photoplethysmography, where a probe is placed internally following the application of the Vela or placebo. You get to watch a neutral video which might be a cartoon, for example, and an erotic video that you’ve selected to be stimulating as the as the volunteer. We’ve demonstrated the value and does increase blood flow both to neuro-neutral visual stimuli and more Soto erotic stimuli. But finally, we did a pilot trial of women that were both pre-menopausal and, you know, young women 23 to older postmenopausal women, 63 years of age. And when we sit, you know, for trials of Vela topical serum, it’s an external application, and the vulva, labia MINOURA. That is the outside of the vestibule and the clitoris, you wait 20 minutes.

And what we’ve demonstrated is that in women who were already orgasmic, there was a 60% increase in arousal, meaning the ability, the frequency, and or maintenance of lubrication, nine out of 10 women had an improvement in a parameter or more of orgasm with 40%. Having increased frequency of orgasm 50%, increased ease of orgasm, and 60% increased intensity of orgasm. And these are, this was a pilot trial that was open-label, we’re about to embark on a statistically powered, randomized clinical trial that’s placebo control of 250 women, but we have a real-world experience with over a couple 100,000 Women and the overall response rate and satisfaction rate with the pleasure serum in women, regardless of age is 65 to 70%. So we’re seeing what we saw on the pilot trial. They’re validated in the real world.

Kevin Anthony 19:37
Yeah, those are some pretty high numbers. How does that compare to like, say, you know, when a new drug is launched?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 19:46
Let’s talk about men and Viagra. I was one of the authors of the New England journal publication on the Viagra pivotal data and in that study, where everything is ideal and you get support and you come in and you participate In the study, the response rate for Viagra was 70%, which is, you know, outstanding. In the real world, it’s closer to 50%. Because other factors come into play. And so we’re in a different population, one woman to not have a physical abnormality or it’s not a dysfunction by medical definition, it’s an enhancement. And the response rates are 66% to 70%. So, you know, it’s comparing apples to oranges, but it is really, for the first time the scientific validation that there are ways for women to enhance their arousal to increase their probability of frequency ease, and intensity of orgasm. And to do it in a safe setting with you know, conduct something that’s commonly compatible. We’ve also studied the effects should you apply this internally, which is unnecessary, or have some concerns about an internal application? We Val has been studied, valid pleasure serum has been studied on its effect on the vaginal microflora, and it does not change the bott vaginal microbiome, well.

Kevin Anthony 21:14
That’s good to know, that’s literally the first thing that popped into my head when you were saying internal application, I’m saying, oh, man, you put anything in there, you can mess with that internal flora. So you’ve actually studied that?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 21:23
You know, the way we do things exactly like we would if we were a pharmaceutical company, we study everything we just haven’t been, you know, we’ve, we’ve decided there is an entity that Vella Bioscience sponsored, and I’m the chairman of it, it’s called the Consortium for the study of women’s sexual wellness. We have a Scientific Advisory Board comprised of a dozen past presidents of the International Society for the Study of Women’s sexual health. This is the International largest female sexual medicine society and we have past presidents from their pioneers in the field, we also have past presidents from the North American menopause society. And what the consortium is trying to do is say enough of the kind of beauty promise squishy stuff that female sexual wellness has been producing, and let’s ship this to be medical adjacent.

We’re not pharmaceuticals, we’re not a pharmaceutical company, where we can bring the same science. And women deserve to know what the probability what the data is, that if they try a product they will have success, you know. And there’s a real concerted effort to also profile other companies that are bringing science to the field and I think it’s about time to shift female sexual wellness out of beauty out of cosmetics, whatever it is that it’s been in, to medical adjacent, there’s a, there’s an enormous amount of science and clinical research science and clinical research, instruments and tools that exist in that field, the wheel doesn’t need to be reinvented, we just need to apply it to wellness and to wellness for women so that we can give them data on products as to whether they’re effective and well tolerated.

Kevin Anthony 23:13
Yeah, I love that approach of using the best parts that science has to offer, right, and applying it to something that is not necessarily a chemical that may potentially have side effects. So merging those two worlds together, I think really is a fantastic way to go. I’m curious, just by what you’ve mentioned, are you also working on other products for female sexual wellness that also blend this research approach with this more? For lack of a better term? I know I used nutraceutical earlier maybe that’s not the right term but sort of more I guess, natural, not non-pharmaceutical type product right?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 23:57
More right and cannabidiol are cannabinoids that are not like THC, meaning ones that you know they have there are some that are pro-sexual and some that are not so taking, like, we’re not a cannabis company. We’re a wellness company that likes to approach things in a very scientific format adjacent way there. We you know, identify a number of female, sexual, and general urinary wellness targets. Menopause is complicated and we have we have nothing that’s a product yet for menopause except a lubricant. A lube that we have that has hyaluronic acid in it and it’s the Val LX elixir. The hyaluronic acid is hydrating and it’s a nice combination with the Vela pleasure serum for use in women who are particularly over there in menopause.

But an area where we’ve really made some headway on applying the same science if you will. To predict the development a product is for dysmenorrhea which is painful menses 90% of women have painful menses sometimes to the point of debilitating pain that results in loss of work and other quality of life issues, mom we so the pain that comes in primary dysmenorrhea is lifelong not associated with a medical disease or disorder, and not associated with endometriosis or had no meiosis. It starts from the onset of menarche is persistent, lifelong, and isn’t associated with a medical disease or disorder. What’s the pain from the pain from prostaglandins, which stimulate nerve fibers that make you feel pain? Where does that cop prostaglandin in the uterus count for a while when the uterus is contracting, and shedding the lining and expelling the that shed, that muscle contraction also causes a lack of oxygen and a release of prostaglandins that create pain.

If you can reduce the intensity of those contractions, but not the frequency, you can still get effective, you know, lining shutting and discharge but reduce pain. And we’ve demonstrated that there are molecules of nutraceuticals that are able to do that. And we’ve done a clinical trial on 50 women and demonstrated that you can shift pain from moderate-severe down to mild or no pain, without any oral analgesics and about 80% of women who have primary dysmenorrhea will be presenting some of that data and we’ll have a product actually a suppository late 2024 for the treatment for the management of primary dysmenorrhea. And of the 50 women that were in the trial 80% said that they would prefer the suppository, as opposed to a oral medication.

Kevin Anthony 27:07
Wow, that is very, very interesting. That is definitely a problem a lot of women deal with and up to this point other than basically, you know, numbing themselves out with painkillers I’m not really aware of any other way to deal with that.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 27:25
Um, well, there are there’s research ongoing, but no real products that are out there yet. We hope to have one of the first if not the first effective products with data to show how it works, why it works, and how many women would respond. And it’s a personal preference. Some people prefer a pill other people have no problems with suppose you know, this is an intro vaginal suppository with Gator.

Kevin Anthony 27:48
Yeah, I think I think most women are generally okay with and familiar with using depositories because they use them for lots of other things. Do you know whether they have yeast infections or you know, imbalances in the microphone? microbiome, the floor? There? I think they’re pretty used to that. So I can’t imagine that would be a hard sell for most women. Right?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 28:11
Yeah, you’re absolutely right.

Kevin Anthony 28:14
Okay, so. So you’ve got obviously, the product that we were talking about earlier with you know, helping with the arousal you’re working on this one is your goal with this company and the consortium to have a full range of things to address all the common issues that women would have?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 28:33
Well, I think we’re focused on sexual wellness. So you know, we want to improve our products, we want to maybe look at other domains the other ways too in an additive or maybe synergistic way with develop pleasure serum to increase orgasm, because at the end of the day, you know, desire and arousal all feed into the upper and the game which is orgasm. We are definitely interested in menopause and definitely started being interested in genital urinary complications from menopause. And also, as we discussed menstrual pain. We’re not a pharmaceutical company, but we think we can develop products that are effective and well tolerated in these domains using for lack of a better word non-pharmaceutical nutraceuticals

Kevin Anthony 29:25
Well, I think this is really quite exciting that somebody is finally taking the time to do the proper research and to develop products that are non pharmaceutical that address these areas because it does seem it seems from not only my own perception but from what you are telling me that there there’s a big lack of those types of products in the market at the moment.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 29:49
There’s a ton of products but they’re being promoted like beauty products, you know, it’s like a promise there’s no real data. Some of the trials that have been done are phenomenal because they are 100% successful. But the success is measured using instruments that aren’t validated that haven’t been used in, you know, sexual pharmacotherapy research protocols. So the consortium is not involved in promoting products. The consortium is involved in promoting bringing science to female sexual wellness and serving women the same way we’ve served and I’ve served men in the past in developing Edie drugs and in developing the field of male sexual pharmacotherapy.

Kevin Anthony 30:31
Well, anytime you see a study that says 100% success rate, you should be weird. That should be the first red flag right there because nothing ever has 100% success. Right?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 30:44
Right. But I mean, you know unless you can tell people that, you know, this has a 50, let’s just say a 50% success rate, right? Women will then go into it without that information, thinking it’s 100%, or it should work for them. And I think you have to have realistic expectations. Because when we’re dealing with biology, as you said, Nothing is 100%.

Kevin Anthony 31:05
Yeah, absolutely. I agree with those realistic expectations. And I don’t know the effectiveness of these other products. But, you know, having heard, you know, what you’ve said about the way they haven’t done the testing or the way they do testing and show, it’s 100%. The thing that bothers me about that is you have women who are really seeking help or relief in a particular area, and they’ve made a bunch of promises that may or may not actually live up to the promise. And that’s, that’s unfortunate, right? So I think the more data, the more information that they can have to make a choice about what’s the right thing for them. And going into that choice with a reasonable expectation is very valuable.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 31:56
Yes, we agree with the other, we’re on the same page on that. And it’s not cosmetics, it’s not, you know, it’s not your skin glowing, you’re looking to reduce distress, enhance your function, enhance your intimacy, enhance your relationships. And you’d like to know whether you’re using your paid for something that actually has any potential for benefit. And there are probably products out there that haven’t been studied that have potential. The Consortium and its scientific advisory board is here to help those companies develop their products and provide expertise and support if they’re interested in doing so, we’d like to build a whole community of companies and products that actually serve are there for sex care, something we’ve trademarked as a concept and something that we believe strongly in the use of science in the service of women.

Kevin Anthony 32:51
Well, that’s interesting. That’s a good point to bring up there that with the consortium, you’re not just doing that for specifically your company, you want to open it up to all these other companies and say, Hey, if you want help, using science to validate your product, we’re here to help you. I’m really curious to see how many of them take you up on that.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 33:12
Well, we there are other companies out there that are doing maybe not for arousal, applying good science, for example, there are smart vibrators that can study your orgasm, and there are devices that are and we’ll be profiling these companies and we’ll call them out. There are companies that are studying other areas of female sexual wellness are female genital urinary wellness in a very scientific manner, when we want to call those out, we just don’t have any companies that have studied arousal. This requires a great deal of expertise. Really, you know, our basic science studies that are done by the premier lab and Paris are Badgal photoplethysmography studies done by a, an expert in this area from the Kinsey Institute that’s in, in Los Angeles. So my expertise and our lab’s expertise is in developing lysosomes. And in knowing what to study and how to study, these are very specific levels of expertise. And they’re not readily available. And certainly, if you don’t have a scientific background, and you’re in the wellness space, and you don’t know what to do, we’d be happy to have, from the Consortium’s perspective at least give you some direction on what you should be studying and maybe who you should be talking to?

Kevin Anthony 34:34
Well, I think that’s a tremendously valuable resource. Now, obviously, companies who don’t have a lot of faith in their product may want to run in the other direction. But if you really believe in your product, I think that’s a that’s a tremendous resource that they have potentially available to them.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 34:49
Right. And I think that you’re going to see that there’s going to be a shift in this where if you aren’t studying things and you aren’t able to provide data, the viability of your product will be you know, questioned.

Kevin Anthony 35:00
Right so as more companies get on board, the ones that don’t get on board are suddenly going to lose a lot of market share.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 35:08
Right now, we use a contract research organization for our clinical trials that are excellent centers, and labs. And you know, citrus is also trying to get an inspiring company. And I think companies understand that. The, ultimately it is the consumer who’s going to drive the field, and the consumers demanding data. And so there are other entities not necessarily in developing arousal products, but like citrus and CROs and other people, biostatisticians, etc, that are available that drive this field towards a more scientific to be medical adjacent, if you will, for lack of a better term. And I think that’s going to happen regardless. So either you’re doing it now, on to understanding that’s where the field is going, or you probably won’t be a player in the future.

Kevin Anthony 36:02
Yeah. Well, as long as the science that’s being done is genuine science, and not science, rigged for profit. This is an amazing thing.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 36:12
Yeah, and there are great guidelines on you know, the NIH is involved in questionnaires that look at outcomes. There, is great science that already exists that can be deployed in the wellness arena. So you know, we’ll even be able to compare apples to apples or apples to oranges when we look across products in the future, maybe even head-to-head trials, preference trials, and but the first trials to do are the randomized, placebo-controlled double-blind trials where you compare it to placebo, because sexuality and sexual enhancement and sexual dysfunction treatment have a large placebo response, right?

Kevin Anthony 36:53
Yeah, yeah. And I imagine there’s a certain amount of subjectivity in patients’ responses to not so much in measuring, you know, the relaxation of a muscle or the amount of lubrication, but in how they report the experience.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 37:08
But that report is important right there in developing drugs for sexual dysfunction, then, the FDA puts great weight on patient-reported outcomes, whether it’s a questionnaire or a diary in the events at home, because the proof is in the pudding that at the end of the day is what’s important, not whether there’s lubrication of the muscle or like, but were you aroused? Did you have an orgasm? Were you satisfied?

Kevin Anthony 37:33
Indeed, that’s what it comes down to at the end of the day. Was the sex Good? Did you enjoy it? Are you satisfied? Okay, I went a little bit past when I would normally do a break. So I’m going to just take a quick break. And then I want to come in and ask you just two last questions and then we’ll wrap up.

All right, are you a couple are your relationship and sex life where you want them to be? Are there changes you would like to make but just don’t know how maybe you think there’s nothing that can be done. If you’re not 100% happy with where your relationship or sex life is, then get help today and change your life. Go to KevinandCéline.com/sex-coaching-couples/. Don’t worry about the long link it is in the description below. Schedule a strategy call with me today. So we can map out a strategy to get you where you want it to be. So you can have it all your way. That is KevinandCéline.com/sex-coaching-couples/. The link is in the description below. You know, one of the advantages to working with me when your sex life is not where you want it to be, is that I get to interview interesting people like my guest today and I get to learn all of this stuff, and then I get to share it with you through my coaching. So go check that out. KevinandCéline.com/sex-coaching-couples/.

Okay. So I’m wondering if you have any last advice for women or even potentially for men if they’re experiencing that their woman has, you know, low arousal and they’re not sure what to do about it. But any last advice for people who may be experiencing low female sexual arousal?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 39:16
I think the advice is if you think this is something serious, you should probably seek medical attention. But if it’s been something that’s been creeping up and age-related or not age-related, and you want to try something over the counter, you by the way, our website is Vellabioscience.com You can try Vela BIOS pleasure serum for arousal. I think the important thing is you know interestingly half of our sales are to men for their partners so you know, include your partner in the discussion, seek medical attention, perhaps if you’re concerned And there are there’s, there are products for desire disorder that a doctor can prescribe. There are lubricants that may facilitate painless sexual activity and ones that are specifically for menopause. But Bella pleasure serves the only agent that’s been demonstrated clinically to be effective in enhancing female sexual arousal.

Kevin Anthony 40:22
Well, I think that is great advice. Obviously, always good to be checked out by your doctor first to rule out anything that’s really a problem. And then from there to look at options like the serum that you guys make. So yeah, I think that’s a good route. Good recommendation for people. Any last words?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 40:43
No, I’d like to thank you, Kevin. And hopefully, your viewership found this interesting and informative. It was a nice long discussion. Thanks for the opportunity.

Kevin Anthony 40:52
You’re welcome. I do, however, have one last question for you. It’s a question I asked everybody that comes on the show. And it’s funny because I have a broad range of people. So for some people, this question is like, no big deal at all. For others, they turn pretty beat red in the face. But the question is, what is your best sexual talent?

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 41:13
Oh, my God, I think we’re talking about women here. So I won’t respond to that about me. It’s always unusual, to have two men talking about female sexuality, right? My talents should be on the back burner.

Kevin Anthony 41:31
All right, I’ll give you a pass on that one. It is a little interesting, you know, two men talking about but somebody’s got to talk about it. Right. The point is, it needs to be talked about and it needs to be, we need to get it out there into the mainstream.

Dr. Harin Padma-Nathan 41:44
Well, I should tell you that our leadership is female. We have a CEO and co-founder, Carolyn Wheeler, who’s really passionate about this. I provide the science, she provides communication and makes the major decisions that result in our success. So we do have female leadership and always defer to the perspective that women bring for products for women.

Kevin Anthony 42:11
Absolutely. And you know, whether it’s a product for women or a product for men, I think, you know, we really work best as a team when we can bring both men and women together to work on any problem. I think we come up with better solutions. All right, thank you so much for coming on the show and talking about what you are up to. I hope that people found it interesting I did you know, I’m a tech sort of geek in all realms, whether it’s sex or not, like I love to know, what is new, what are we working on? You know, what kinds of things can we expect in the future? So I found it fascinating, and I hope the listeners did as well. Thank you. All right, everybody. That’s all the time I have for this episode. And I will see you next week.

I hope you like this episode of the Love Lab podcast. If you enjoyed this show, subscribe. Leave us a review and share it with your friends. And for more free exclusive content. Join me in the passion vault at KevinandCéline.com/vault. That’s KevinandCéline.com/vault. Thanks for listening. And remember, as Céline used to say you’re amazing!