Balancing Relationships With Career & Kids With Glenn Sandifer

Kevin Anthony 0:11
Welcome to the Love Lab podcast a safe place to get real about sex. Whether you’re a man or woman single or a couple, this is the show for you.

Céline Remy 0:20
We are your hosts, Kevin Anthony and Céline Remy and we are here to guide you to go from good to amazing in the bedroom and beyond.

Kevin Anthony 0:28
All right, welcome back to the Love Lab podcast. This is episode 239. And it’s titled balancing relationships with career and kids with Glen Sandifer. So this is something you know when you do coaching work, and you work with people, you know, most people have kids. And this is something that always comes up, right? Because you’re coaching somebody, and you’re telling them, Hey, here’s what you need to do for your relationship. And then you will always get feedback like, well, you know, yeah, that sounds like a good idea. But I don’t have time or, you know, Mike, the kids this or the work that. And so it is a really important topic. Because again, most people do have kids and most people do have a job, right? And how do you? How do you balance those things? And that’s the basic idea that we’re going to talk about today. I have a ton of questions. I probably won’t get to them all. But there’s going to be some really, really interesting things. Our guest today has created some interesting

Glenn Sandifer 1:27
Thank you, Kevin, thank you for that intro.

Kevin Anthony 1:27
Yeah, I kind of find it fascinating. I mean, I can see the parallels. But I’m not sure that everybody else clearly sees them. So I’m excited to have you talk more about that and show, you know how what you learned in business can also apply in relationships, and vice versa, I think. And, you know, in your bio, it says, you know, great dating outcomes in the modern world. But I think this stuff is going to apply whether you’re dating or whether you’re already in a long-term committed relationship. So we’ll dig into that as we go as well. All right. I would like to start with ideas, frameworks, and ways that you can work with this.

So we’re gonna get into all of that. But before we do a quick word from our first sponsor, do you want to join the secret club of men who are great in bed, then check out power and mastery. It is the most complete sexual mastery training for men, whether you want to have harder erections, last longer, or increase your sexual skills. There is something for you at powerandmastery.com. That is powerandmastery.com. You’ve heard it many times on this show before you know that it that is the men’s sexual mastery course that Céline and I created. It’s been going on strong for a number of years now.

And we continue to get fantastic feedback from it. So go check that out. In fact, I just got an email from somebody recently saying that they were basically addicted to Viagra for a decade, and after taking this course they are off Viagra and back to functioning the way they should. So I strongly recommend that you check that out at power mastery.com. Okay. Our guest today is Glen Sandifer. Glen is a current executive with a major multinational during his 20-year professional journey, he has found parallels between business success and lack of success in relationships, and he created the middle ground to serve as a bridge for professionals looking to get great dating outcomes in the modern world. Welcome, Glenn, to the show.

I’m curious how your background in sales and business leadership has really influenced your relationships

Glenn Sandifer 3:46
Influenced my relationships, I think the best way to start with that would be to go to the beginning of why the middle ground. So as it says, I’ve worked for 20 years in a number of various roles and I’m with a great company right now. But what I found as I began leading individuals, and leading at every stop, that as we begin to have more success with them as an individual, they began communicating more about failures in their personal relationships. So what I did is stop coaching for production and start coaching the whole and total person or the whole man or the total woman. And what I found out of that is that there were a lot of theories that led people to the bad outcome and the relationship and that’s what’s highlighted in part one of the book.

Kevin Anthony 4:36
Right, so this is something that we talked about all the time, because, you know, in the work that I do, and that my wife and I did before she passed, you know, it was primarily around sex and relationship but one of the things that we would always tell people is look, your sex and your relationship are not isolated from the rest of your life, right. So whatever problems are happening in your relationship, you’re likely seeing either the same problems over and in your professional life. Or you’re seeing repercussions in your professional life, and vice versa, right?

So when you’re struggling in your job and your career, and you’re having tough days at the office, then you’re coming home, and you’re bringing that to your home. And so you’re absolutely right when you talk about the fact that these things are not isolated, right, and that they are both affecting each other all the time. And so if you want to coach somebody, say, from a business perspective, you do have to take into account the entire person, the whole person, and everything that’s happening in their life. So I completely agree with that. I’m curious, also, if you’ve seen any recent trends in that work, relationship balance, like things that maybe are happening today that are really prominent? And if I don’t know if they are, but if they are different then maybe stuff that you saw a few years ago, or even a decade ago?

Glenn Sandifer 6:01
So yes, to answer your question, things are very different than where they were a decade ago. And I’ll say, from my personal standpoint, a lot of the conversation was around just the relationship and wanting marriage, most people don’t. So most people are finding satisfaction or they change with a goal, to have a long-term committed relationship. And again, at the middle ground, we don’t judge that we just say that we believe one man, one woman, creating one relationship with marriage as an outcome. So if you don’t subscribe to that, the middle ground isn’t for you.

But what we find today is that unlike 10 years ago, people are saying, I don’t need the relationship until everything professionally is aligned. Meaning I want to be the VP of marketing, I would like to be a partner, I’d like to be in my practice, and I’d like to have my accounting firm started up. And what they decide to do is then take what they knew from 10 years ago, and apply it to dating today, and partner and pair bonding today. And if you are someone, a man or woman who decides to skip the relationship piece for your 20s and 30s, or late 30s, and decide to start looking to settle down, the rules are different. And that’s what we discovered and what I communicate about the middle ground, I say that there are more options, more choices, and more opportunities than ever before for both men and women.

But we are having worse relationship outcomes than at any other time in history. We have more technology, we have more access, more health care, and better health care. But we are still struggling with relationships. And that is because there are four things that people have not done. They have not said, Who am I? So they don’t know who they are. They haven’t said what do I want. They don’t know what they want. They haven’t said with what I want someone, what do I qualify for, they don’t know what they go on for. And then the final thing is they don’t know what that person that they qualify for what they want from them. So it is a linear step, and requires an individual to do the work on the front end in order to get the outcome. So we go back to our example of the doctor, the doctor may say, I’m going to date the same type of girl that I dated 10 years ago, 15 years ago, and they’re going to have a very bad relationship outcome. Because what they need today is different than what they needed 15 years ago.

Kevin Anthony 8:31
Yeah, okay. A lot of things there. I want to back up to the beginning of what you said. And then I want to come back to those four things because those four things are really important. First, I want to talk about this whole, I don’t want to have a relationship until I make partner and until I you know, start the bid until all of these things. I’m curious. It sounds like you’re not necessarily judging that saying it’s right or wrong. Is that correct?

Glenn Sandifer 8:59
That’s correct. I don’t I don’t judge that decision. Okay. I actually, I actually encouraged that I actually encourage, if you follow the middle ground, and you want the relationship outcome, but you still need the route success, you’re gonna have to wait. So now we’re talking the s cuss word sacrifice. Sacrificing is really hard for us in our society today, especially with all the success. So if I’m having all this success, and I’m moving in the direction, why do I have to wait? Why should I wait? Someone should just be they should be falling at my feet and the things that are falling at your feet are not what you’re going to need 20 years from now.

Kevin Anthony 9:36
Yeah, I’m curious, though. And the reason why I wanted to focus on that little bit is that, I know from my own personal life, I can give some examples. You know, at what point do you say I shouldn’t wait any longer? In other words, let’s say you’re pursuing you know, becoming the VP Well, alright, some people become VPs in their, you know, late 20s Right and after only a few years of working, but for many people, it’s not until they’re in their 40s. Right? So, at a certain point, you have to say, Okay, I’m not quite at partner yet, but I’m starting to you like, I ain’t getting any younger. Right? And so, so my question is like, okay, great, I get it. And I understand that you have to do some, you know, sacrifice compromise, maybe if you want to use that word. In other. In other words, you need this focus time on your career if you have those goals. But at what point do you finally say, okay, either I’m there, or I’m not there? And if I don’t focus on creating relationships, now, I’m potentially doing myself a disservice. Like, how does somebody know where that line is?

Glenn Sandifer 10:49
I think that line depends on if you’re a man or woman, and what type of man you are. I have six versions of men and six versions of women that I talk about in the book.

Kevin Anthony 10:59
Oh, yes, we’re gonna, we’re gonna get to that for sure that the question?

Glenn Sandifer 11:03
I think the other answer. And part of that is, if you’re someone who is driving towards success, you need to make you’re going to have to make a bet and make a deal. So you’re going to have to decide, I’m not going to make partner until 38. Do I want to wait until 38? And people will say, No, why should I wait? All right, you’re gonna have to do the evaluation period. And you’re gonna have to make a bet earlier. And you got to do your research to make sure that that pays off. So if you’re someone who’s going to be partner, but does that mean, I’m Billy 16, to 2000 hours a year, translation to everyone in the audience, they’re working 80 to 90 hours, I know the math doesn’t work up. But they’re working that many hours. What does that mean? From a relationship standpoint, the relationship is second.

So we emotionally, the second, the physical need a second, because 80 to 90 hours is not just something you can do Monday through Friday, that has to be additional work, that’s going to go into it. So you need to make a deal with someone that is aligned with helping you get to that outcome and providing the relationship. So then you will be in a situation where you’re not having to make as many professional sacrifices because nothing is changing professionally about that need.

Kevin Anthony 12:22
Yeah, I’m glad that you bring this up. Because, you know, Selena and I used to say all the time, because, for a long time, there was this huge thing about you know, for women, like, you can have it all, you can be the CEO, and you can be the mom, and you can be the wife and you could have it all at one time. And, you know, as a woman and a successful woman and a very feminine woman, she would look at that and say, No, you can’t. Because you do every one of those things half-ass. So yeah, you can, you can do it all at once. But you’re not going to give your career enough time. Because you’re not going to have the 80 to 90 hours, you’re not going to give your child enough time because you’re working, you know, maybe 60 hours. And so this idea that you really can’t have it all at once and be good at it all and do a good job at all of it, I think is a fantasy. And it’s interesting. You didn’t quite say that. So I don’t want to put words in your mouth. But you are indicating that you have to make choices, that if you want to be VP and put in that 80 to 90 hours a week, then your relationship can’t be your number one priority.

Glenn Sandifer 13:28
And who signs up for that? So when people in the audience and when I’ve been on this kind of roadshow talking about it. Most people say well, I don’t want to sign up for that. I don’t need to sacrifice anything. Well, I start in my coaching says assessments asking, sorry, especially asking, what is it that you want? And they’re like, What do you mean? What do you want to be? I don’t know. And then I give some parameters around it? Where do you want to be at 65? So most of the people I’ve coached are in their 20s to early 40s. So that’s still anywhere between 40 to 25 plus years, that is a long time.

And especially if you make bad decisions, you’re going to have to pay for that. So I say what you need, and you want to look at your life as 65 Let’s back into it. So I always start with the professional. What do you want your profession to be? This is what I want. I want to be a partner in my law firm in the next 15 years. Okay, what does it take to be a partner to a law firm, time, investment, relationships, and building so you have to be profitable to the bottom line. You have to get along with people in the company, culturally be a fit, and you have to be willing to make sacrifices day in and day out. Alright, so we got the first 15 What type of relationship do you want? 65? Well, I want to be married for 30 years. I want five kids. I want six grandkids. Okay. What type of wife would you like to have?

Do you want her to work outside the home or do you want her to work in the home only, I didn’t think about that. So we’ve spent the first part of the session, figuring out how to tactically go after both work and the relationship, because what you don’t want to do is say, I want a woman who works, I support her career, I want us to be a power couple. And then you guys start going there, and then you guys are apart. And when you grow apart, you’re never going to get to the goal for 65. Because she’s not sacrificing from a time standpoint. So the relationship failed, and you’re not sacrificing. So that may be a misalignment, you may want to say, Okay, I want a woman to learn, but I only need her to do it and contribute 25 to 30% of the household bills.

Okay, where would you like to live? Chicago, Illinois, what is it costs for a family of five, sorry, seven, five kids to adults to live in Chicago, Illinois? Today, I’ll wait. And we just pull it up online. And we can see what the median is in the area. And we can see what it needs to be. And then we start adding things. I mean, the vacations, the type of car, private school public, fully funded retirement, funding the five kids to go to college, that isn’t gonna cost you something. So that means you’re going to have to be a partner, you’re going to have to have income coming in through stocks and bonds, and you’re going to have to have a business. And then the things that your wife do risk are going to have to aid in that. So again, what type of wife do you want? Think I was the one who doesn’t work outside.

Kevin Anthony 16:30
So this is fascinating. I love hearing you describe this, because, honestly, I’m pretty sure that the overwhelming majority of people never actually think it through even anywhere near as detailed as what you just described. And you gave us I think the sort of 40,000 foot overview just now. Right? And so I completely agree with you. And this is where I think a lot of people go wrong is they just kind of stumble their way through life and things just kind of happen. And then they end up where they end up. Because they didn’t take the time to do exactly what you’re suggesting, which is to sit down and plan it out for my wife and I maybe not quite as detailed as what you’re describing.

But we did that when we got together. We sat down and said, Okay, where do we want to be in five years in 10 years, in 20 years when we’re old? Where do we want to be financially? Where do we want to be in our relationship? Where do we want to be with our business that we were building together? And I just don’t understand how people well, one, how they don’t do it. And two, how they complain down the road later on when they don’t get what they want. But they never actually sat down to formulate a plan to get it.

Glenn Sandifer 17:43
Well, we’re not taught any of this at school. It’s supposed to be taught with our family unit and with our extended family and community. But that’s been broken down. So since it’s not taught, we have to go outside of our local area, especially if you’ve never seen it. But for most people that I’ve coached, especially when we do wellness checkups because when I call them a year later, after coaching, I asked them the outcome. And as they tell me their actions, your actions Tell me more than what you say. So your actions are saying, I don’t want a relationship. I just want to be out on Broadway, I live in Nashville, I want to be on Broadway, I want to drink, I want to just live life, I want to travel, I want to do boys’ trips, I want to play 2k or Madden. That’s what you’re telling me with your actions. But you said on paper, you’ve wanted this big life and this grand life of a great relationship, you’re not going to get it on Broadway, you’re not going to get it on to K in that you’re not going to get it on a boy’s trip to Vegas, I need you to change your mindset around this. And a lot of the coaching that I do is really around the mindset.

Kevin Anthony 18:53
Yeah, so so that’s where just to come a little bit back to those four questions, right, like really asking yourself, what is it that you’re looking for? And getting really honest about it?

Glenn Sandifer 19:04
Yeah, so it’s most, most all, fortune 500 organizations have a vision statement. Along with the mission statement. Your vision statement should clearly identify to shareholders, to employees, to vendors, to customers who you are. And a lot of times, companies that are kind of questionable. They don’t have a clear vision. They’re off and everything. We’ve seen this for most people in your audience. I won’t date myself, but the tech, the tech boom, there are all these companies that were just blowing up. They were making people multimillionaires overnight. And when you looked on their website, what are you doing it? When I see and I have seen job postings that friends or clients bring to me. I’m like, I don’t understand what that company does. What do you mean? I’ve read their vision statement online. I don’t know what they do. The question you need to ask, are they going to be here in 20 years? And if that’s the case, then where do you fit in that? So I say that you need Have you know, you are going to have a vision statement?

Kevin Anthony 20:03
Well, yeah, that is absolutely true. I’ve helped found two nonprofits, and I spent a lot of time helping them craft their vision statements. In fact, one of them we just did recently. And yeah, my whole role in that was trying to get people to see what you’re telling me isn’t clear. If I wasn’t involved in the organization, I would have no idea what you’re talking about. Right? So helping them get really, really clear on that. So yeah. You know, vision and mission statement, are super important.

Glenn Sandifer 20:36
So yes, having a vision statement is going to be very important as you move through life. So question number one is paramount.

Kevin Anthony 20:43
Yeah. I’ll also add just as an anecdote, having spent 20 years in the tech industry myself, I can tell you that if you want a long-term career with a company where you move up the ladder, don’t go anywhere near tech, because that’s not going to happen. That is an absolute, I have worked for some of the biggest tech companies in the world. And I never lasted more than four years at any of them. And none of it had to do with me, it was mergers and all kinds of just corporate shifts and things happening all the time. So yeah, don’t use tech, if you want to stick with a firm for 20 years, because it’s not going to happen.

Glenn Sandifer 21:19
You know, I do a lot of coaching for young men. So I have a different program for high school to college, great man. And most of them I tell, Hey, you want a career for 25 years where you can make six figures a year? Yeah, go into HVAC or plumbing? No much I pay my plumber. You know how much the HVAC guy is on the invoices. And that guy has 40 Vans, the owner has 40 Vans, he’s buying locations throughout multiple markets, why don’t go and get a Literature degree, you can read literature on the weekend.

Kevin Anthony 21:54
I completely agree with that. And, you know, it is also a good time to mention that, you know, in our modern society, we tend to only value those high-degree desk jobs. But the reality is, in today’s environment, the average person unless they’re going to a big name school and walking away with a big degree and have family contacts and things like that, you’re gonna go to school, you’re going to spend 40, 50, 60, 70, 80, $100,000, on your education, you’re going to get out you’re gonna spend five years working for next to nothing by 10 years, you might be making some decent money. And at the end of the day, you’ll end up less financially well off than the plumber.

Glenn Sandifer 22:35
And, you know, plumbers there, they came out of retirement. They said you know what, there’s too much opportunity out here, I came out of retirement, I’m 74 years old, why would I not take advantage.

Kevin Anthony 22:49
Because he’s making bank right now.

Glenn Sandifer 22:50
I’m making bank in my industry. I like to call it blue-collar and truck movement. If you’re moving trucks every day, that’s kind of the business most some blue collar, you know, business owners and managers are in, we can get people on the trucks. It’s like $5,000, sign-on bonus 401k We pay you and your company, your family’s health care, we do it all. And every time we hear is like man, I want to go to school, and I want to go work for Google.

Kevin Anthony 23:21
So well, if anyone listening to this show, if that’s your thought process, take it from somebody who has worked for some of those big companies just like Google, not Google in particular. But just like that, it is not all that it is cracked up to be. And honestly, it probably would have been a whole lot easier. And I probably would have made a lot more money and had a lot less stress if I were a plumber. And I’d say even though I do most of the stuff around the house myself, there are bigger projects that sometimes I just need to hire somebody for. And when I do, it takes weeks, weeks to get them to come to the house. That’s because they are that busy.

Glenn Sandifer 24:01
Which means they’re that valuable. So as I talked about men, and you know the book or chapter two, we talked about encouraging men to build a high-value scale. A high-value skill is not limited to you being a VP of marketing or finance and an organization a high-value skill is something in which you can go to the market and make a profit from what the market needs from you in return for your services. So a high-value scale can be in tech, can be in coding, it can be in engineering, it can also be in low voltage, electrical, HVAC, it could be in salesmanship, and coaching can be in medicine. These are skills that are very focused on in their effort. And I tell him all the time, I was like first thing you need to do is you need to get your career together, pick a high-value skill, and make sure that you move in that direction.

Kevin Anthony 24:57
Yeah, that is fantastic advice. I mean, it’s not really the focus of this particular show, although it is very directly related, but I love that we have the opportunity to really put that out there because part of the reason why those other things like plumbers are so valuable today is because in general, in society, we put so much value on going to school and getting the degree in East African Art, you know, art or literature or whatever it is, that there aren’t enough people to do all those other things anymore. And so now the value is up. And, and it’s just it’s really important for people to understand that. Yeah, your look for the areas where you can add value where things are needed, where you can solve people’s problems, like the number one thing they teach you as an entrepreneur is find a problem that is that people really want solved and solve it and you will never, you know, be hard up for work or money if you can do that.

Glenn Sandifer 25:55
Right. It’s all about solving problems. Because entrepreneurship, when people say I want to be an entrepreneur, first thing, I was like, alright, what problem? are you solving? them? Sorry? No, I want to go you do vending machines. Okay, you’re solving hunger in an emerging environment with high-traffic areas. So is that the business you want to be? Oh, okay, then don’t go don’t buy vintage.

Kevin Anthony 26:18
Right. Okay, I don’t want to go too far down that rabbit hole. But I always love an opportunity to bring up something that’s really valuable and important in today’s society. And I think that the whole conversation really is valuable and important. So let’s continue on. And I wonder, what is the biggest thing that you see people struggling with when they’re trying to balance this career and relationship?

Glenn Sandifer 26:43
The biggest thing they struggle with, if we’re taking off who they are, is what they want. They don’t know what they want. Instagram and Tiktok tell them what they want. their friends, their friends, and their social circle don’t even tell inform what people want anymore. So if I have, let’s say, I have a career and I figured out the high-value skill. So I’m going to be an attorney, I’m going to go to the market, I got a job opportunity. I went to school, and we got $75,000 in debt. So now I’m gonna say, I want Instagram, I like this girl. I like the way she looks. She likes my post, let me DM her or shoot my shot. And then you don’t know her. You don’t know what our interests are. And you don’t know if everything you see is real. And so you invest this time in this relationship without knowing who, what it is that you want. And most people can’t tell me what they want to ask.

Kevin Anthony 27:44
Yeah, I am not at all surprised that is the answer that you gave me. Because again, you know, just doing the work that I do, which is focusing on their sex, love and relationship part of their lives, they often don’t know what they want, either or, or they do exactly what you said earlier, which is they tell you they want one thing, but then you look at their actions, and you see their actions are taking them in a completely different place. So how do you help them understand what it is they actually want?

Glenn Sandifer 28:13
Well, in sales, we call them discovery questions. So the best salesperson that anyone in your audience has ever had. They spoke more than a salesperson, their salesperson’s job was to find that pain point, discover that pain point, build rapport, earn the right to present a solution to that pain, and then create a deal around that solution that is sales. So it’s one of the oldest professions out there. So with that, I asked discovery questions like, what was your upbringing? Maybe? Because you grew up in a two-parent household Single, single-parent household single dads and single mothers.

Single mom, did your mom ever get remarried? She didn’t get remarried. How long was she married? He still knew she got divorced in 11 years. Okay. Were there any kids that I know? Okay. Do you have a relationship with your dad? No. Do you know like your dad or your mom didn’t work out? No. Have you asked this question? No. Okay. All right. What do you want? I want to be married. What example do you have of marriage? I don’t. Okay, where are you going to get the knowledge in order to be in a successful marriage? I don’t know. I guess that’s why I’m talking to you.

Okay. Well, let’s let me give you a suggestion. If you don’t mind, because we talked for the last 30 minutes. Why don’t you schedule a call with your dad? Because he living Yeah, schedule culture that? Well, we don’t really have a relationship. I encourage you to start that relationship. If he didn’t. If is there an issue of abuse or trauma or attitude issue? No, no, I just you know, we just don’t have a relationship. Start there. Then ask your mom. Mom, why did your dad not work? Then ask your dad Why did you and mom not work? Then compare the two stories because there’s his side, her side and the truth. So compare the two, and figure out the truth. And then once you determine the truth, no, I don’t want to repeat this cycle. So if I don’t want to repeat the cycle, what causes that cycle?

So now I know what happened in my own lineage. I know what led to it. I know what is the problem that led to the breakdown, and now I need to not do that. Then I need to ask myself, are you doing that in your current relationships? And the answer overwhelmingly, is always Yeah, yeah, I’m doing the same thing. I’m abandoning situations I’m running when things get hard, you know, passing responsibility off to others, you know, I’m just not being accountable. Okay, I need you to stop being a male and move into a man. And that is a process. And that’s a process we’re going to do together.

Kevin Anthony 30:54
Oh, I like the way you put that. I need you to stop being male and be a man. That is That is interesting. In my personal opinion, I think we are severely lacking in men these days. In other words, this idea that you know, as a man, there are certain responsibilities. There are certain ways that you need to show up, not only in your own life but in your family life and in your relationship, that I think a lot of, quote-unquote, men just don’t do anymore. And when I look at a lot of these men, I’m doing the air quotes thing again, if you’re listening on the podcast, I see basically old teenagers.

Glenn Sandifer 31:43
Prolonged adolescence?

Kevin Anthony 31:45
Yeah, exactly. So I see them acting the same way they were when they were in their teens and early 20s. But they’re 40. And they got a family of four.

Glenn Sandifer 31:55
How did that happen? Like, like, really? That’s a question people ask no, that dad will ask the toilet. How did I get here? But you know, I say that too, I’m going to echo that all of the women who are in your audience will say the same thing. There are, there are only all these males running around here pretending to be men when I entered this space on accident because I didn’t want to be here. Just wanted to release the book and move on with my life, the anger around the manosphere and the woman’s fear, it led me to validate what I wrote. I said you all are not talking about the men and women, you guys are males and females.

Because I say that what’s lacking to make a man which makes him by definition of male is the emotional intelligence and the responsibility, taking accountability. So if for your audience, before anyone else, if you come across a man, he looks like a man, he talks like a man, he stands like a man, he appears to be a man. But there is always this emotional challenge that he is dealing with. He can’t seem to get over the hump. He’s always running into stumbles in his relationships. And as profession. He’s always seeking stronger, more independent women, and he’s very deferential in every situation, specifically the limit. He’s a male. He’s wanting the respect that men receive, but he has not yet earned it by building himself up a creating enough value, that a high-value skill that makes him a man in the marketplace.

So he’s, he spends his life 20 years, 30 years in perpetual frustration, because he can’t get past this male. And because he can’t get past the male dumb when he connects with a woman, and he typically gets with a modern woman, a female, or a city girl. And all of the problems we can talk about on another day, that come out of this male in a relationship with those three specific women. And those three specific women, when they come across any other man when he is modern, traditional or high value. And when she meets him, and she has bad experiences with city boys males, she says that’s all man.

Kevin Anthony 34:27
Wow, what you just shared is very, very powerful. I love the fact that there are more people out there that are teaching this stuff, this idea of what it means to be a real man and what it means to be a real woman because it’s been lost, in my opinion, and Céline would have absolutely agreed with me because we talked about it a lot. It’s really been lost in modern society. And I think that that is responsible for a lot of the problems that we have. And if we could get P back on track, and get them to accept the roles that they need to accept in life. I think a lot of our problems would go away.

Okay, I really want to come back to what you were just talking about with the three different types of women and men and how those relate to each other. Because I think that is fascinating. I do want to do a short break, though, for our second sponsor. Hey, guys, you know, what makes a man great, you know, the kind of masculine man women are irresistibly attracted to and want Is it money, job title, physical body, is it because he’s great in bed has a big penis or great pickup lines, maybe it is all of those or none of those. But what if you don’t have those are only some of them. What if you’ve had a string of failed relationships are embarrassed by your bedroom skills, doubt whether you can rise to the occasion, worry about lasting long enough, or are always stuck in the friend zone?

And then I can help you if you are ready to make big changes and finally become the man you have always wanted to be, then this is the program for you. To find out more, go to Célineremy.com/go/warrior. That is my coaching program where I will coach you to be the best man that you can be in your sex, love and relationship life. And I would suggest, you know, having a great conversation here with Glenn, if you need to get really clear on your goals, especially around your business and how you’re going to fit that in with your relationship, that you also check his stuff out which, at the end of this episode, of course, he will have an opportunity to tell you exactly where he can you can get a hold of him and his work in material.

But yeah, if you’re struggling with any of those things, you need to work probably with both of us. Yes. All right, that is Célineremy.com/go/warrior. The link is in the description. All right. So we were just talking a little bit about the three types of women and the three types of men. And obviously, I’m assuming from what you’ve already told us, there’s going to need to be alignment with the types. And I imagine that you see certain types more than others, and you probably see certain combinations more than others these days, maybe you could tell the audience a little bit about that.

Glenn Sandifer 37:18
So there are six types. And most people now call out their seven. Okay, so there are six men and six women. So I’ll do the parallel. So boys and girls, they all have sons and daughters, boys and girls. So we won’t go into that boys and girls are not ready for a relationship. They’re not mature enough to handle anything related to a relationship, right, a responsible responsibility. They play with toys, they spend time with their things that are inconsequential.

Then we have city boys and city girls, or F boys and F girls, depending on where you from. So the city boy and the city girl have a lot of things in common. They’re typically very charismatic. They get along with pretty much everyone in every environment. They are very flashy. They are a life of the party. City boys often are described as attractive, or handsome, really physically fit, they make decent money. But they’re always looking to bet as many women as possible. And they can do it because the women that they communicate with talk about chemistry, and conversation. If you’ve heard the two C’s of chemistry and conversation, most women are talking about a city boy because city boys are well-versed in conversation and making sure that women feel like there’s a chemical spark. city girls do the same.

But they’re a little bit more. They’re a little bit more focused on making sure that when they have their relationship outcome, they like the city boy are also in the driver’s seat. And the city girl also highlights things related to her ability to make an income, her ability to provide for herself and her children. Her ability to say she does not need to man. So we have city, then we have guys and gals for dudes and chicks. These are just regular people that you know, these are people that you see at Target, Starbucks, see him at the gym, there’s nothing very special about them. And they live a very normal life playing like nothing harmful, nothing bougie they don’t take a lot of vacations or trips. They still they’re often overlooked by men and by women. Then we have what I see as the largest group, males and females.

So I’ve talked about the male a little bit. So like the male, the female is one who has not moved on or worked on the emotional traumas. So the emotional traumas create this victimhood and because of that victim that we all have to experience that with them. So, if you come across someone that you work with, or come across someone that you’re dating, and they’re always in perpetual crisis, things are very chaotic. Things are very out of place. It’s because she is a female. And a male also has not overcome his emotional deficiencies. He doesn’t even know how to have a conversation at a high level. So he always defers at the Flex, this is where women will see the gaslighting. So they got males and females, then we have men and women. So men and women are in two flavors. First flavor would be tradition. Talk about in chapter one, the tradition comes from the experiences of both my grandfather’s they are the providers of the protectors. They’re the prophets and priests in their home, they have a very high EQ, they’re involved in their civic community duties, they want to do that.

And they expect their traditional woman to take care of them, the children in the home, that’s it, she’s not going to want him to do more or become more if he has a truck, run your truck, if he works at a job for 40 years picket your job for 40 years provide for our family, I’m never going to push you to do more, because this is all I want. And that all is fine. So traditionally, traditionally, then you have the second largest group. Why are men and modern women, you hear a lot in this space about modern women being a problem. That’s not the problem. The problem is females and males. Modern women live their life by leading with their education, leading with their career, leading with their successes, and it often comes off as very masculine. So this is where you see for women have to become more masculine in order to succeed professionally. Modern women don’t want to be that way.

They feel like they had to be that way because of no good men, to allow them to rest in their femininity. And they have had to do it because no one would take care of them. They didn’t have the example of a father, they had every man they had disappointed them in their mother. So they are definitely going to take care of themselves. They want 5050 in their relationship. After the money, have kids, half of the house happened to cars, half the bills happened to planning, you need to do your half, I’ll do my half. And they’re comfortable with 5050 until they’re not. So modern women, then modern men are something that we’ve heard in the marketplace, hybrid man. These are men who based on the environment, they want the outcome, they can’t get a traditional woman, because traditional women typically are grown out of gals, they’re not able to get the tradition, because they don’t have the ability to lead the way my grandfathers did.

They can’t 100% take care of a household. And when they get with a modern woman, because a modern woman has her own lifestyle, it there’s no way he can sustain it. So modern men are working out of necessity, and 5050 everything. So words that you hear for people with this space, I’m looking for a partner, me and my partner, we’re living as partners, we make decisions together, we’re both heads of household. That’s a modern relationship, that type of relationship has only been introduced in society for the last 40 to 50 years. And it became really prevalent in the 2000s. And then the final rule of the six, six A and B with that would be the high-value man and high value. High-Value man is 100% focused on purpose. I value men are born out of traditional men are modern, you have to be man before you can be high-value.

High Value is natural income. I tell people and I talk about in my book, we take out the fame component, athlete, entertainer, politician, preacher, those individuals have a different way of living and a different way that they can attain their relationship status. So we have to take them out of a discussion of high value. And we find most of those anyway are going to be city boys and males. So check them out. But a high-value man is not just as money component. Yes, I talk about you have to be in a situation where for the last five to 10 years, you’ve been making the bliss flow $1,000 a month. That’s kind of the break-off because that means that you’re kind of a high octane high earning whatever your profession is. It’s also a character issue. Most people can’t get to the point of character to where they have high integrity, high morals.

They communicate effectively, and they’re accountable to people. High-Value men are not concerned with just themselves when I talk about purpose, they’re concerned about their family, their legacy, their community, and those people that they impact. So high-value men are 100%. Selfless, they’re looked at as not being selfish, because of the input it takes to achieve all their success. That’s why they have to be a high-value woman. High-Value women are typically born out of traditional women whose mid a sin or modern women who decide I’m not going to do this modern 5050 anymore, I’m ready to let Him lead, what do I need to do to help him get there? Oh, we’re really living at a high level, I didn’t really realize that. Okay, you need more support for me, let me move into that.

And that is a different discussion than what we hear in the space. Because high-value women are 100% focused on their man’s purpose, I’m going to help him drive to that if I need to work or work, I need to take care of the kids, I’ll take care of the kids. If he needs me to come work in the business, I’ll come work in the business, if he needs to go back to school, so I can hold it down, I’m going to do that because it’s going to have you know, guardrails or boundaries around it. And so when you start talking about this fixed height, and we see where people typically want to be, they’re not high value, less than 10% of the market has high value in any given space.

Kevin Anthony 46:23
Yeah, I really liked that. It’s very similar to two types of things that Céline And I would teach, but it’s, it’s a bit more nuanced, actually. And I actually really liked the nuance when I listened to you describe those different types, I can see, like, I know, pick people’s faces are popping into my mind. I’m like, oh, yeah, that describes that person. And that describes that person. It’s, it’s, I like it, I really liked the way that you have laid that out. Because it makes it pretty clear. You know, if we, and there’s this no accident, right? But if we talk about what you were talking about in the beginning of the show, understanding what it is that you want, right? And how are you gonna go about getting there, you need to know where you are on that scale of, like, if you’re a man, you need to know which one of those six are you. And then which one of those 6 do You really actually want to be? So it’s, I think, it’s a fantastic tool to help people get clear on that.

Glenn Sandifer 47:23
Again, and I often tell most people to tell most people that with who you want, you don’t qualify for it. Because most of the people, I’ve had the privilege of working with high value, men only work with them for one session, because it’s really to validate what they believe. But the ones that have mentored me, high value, men don’t go out holding themselves high value. They’re called high value by people who they don’t even know their circle of six or four other 647 other men are all valuable to their group. And they’re all winning in their profession. And they make sure that they stay winning. So when someone who’s the city boy, who plays to K and works out seven days a week does CrossFit and yoga and doesn’t like runs.

And that’s all he is. There’s no way you have value where you meet who you around, while I’m around these people. Okay, what do they do? Well, we all work out. So you guys aren’t even valuable to each other, outside of working out. So there’s no way you can be high value. Okay, you’re a male, you’re not you haven’t even talked to your father, about why he and your mom didn’t work. You can’t even go as a man and have that conversation with him. He will respect that because he’s of a different generation. So he’ll respect that and he’ll give you as much as he can without hurting you and hurting your mom. I guarantee you. You haven’t even approached your mom about her being inappropriate. And making you a son, husband or husband. You haven’t? You haven’t had any conversation. So you’re a male you don’t qualify for how about you? Woman? I’m sorry.

Kevin Anthony 49:10
I’ve never had a coaching session with you other than our pre-interview call. This is the first time I’m talking with you. I love this. If you are actually saying those things to your client’s faces, man, are you doing them a service. You really are. Because this is the kind of stuff that needs to be said, more than ever in this day and age. And most people are afraid to say it.

Glenn Sandifer 49:32
They’re afraid to say it because have so much to lose. The reality is, most of us we were doing a disservice to the mark. So we have to be willing to have the uncomfortable. We call them uncomfortable conversations and coaching sessions with corporate America uncomfortable conversations about why we do things the way that we do. And we have to let each other know we’re not doing this anymore. And this is the reason we’re not because our vision is to go to 2026, or 2027, everyone who’s being corporate they know.

And if you don’t have that conversation professionally, or in your business, you’re going to fail. Just like in your relationship, if you don’t have a conversation, it’s going to fail. Too many of us get into such a delicate situation ships for different jobs. It’s complicated. And no one wants to be the first one for me to have the fade out, what are we doing, and when you do, one, the other person runs. And that’s people’s experience until they’re 38. And so they haven’t had any real relationship training. Just like being yoga, just like CrossFit. Just like, you know, high-intensity interval training, it takes work and you have to ramp up. You can’t spend a decade alone, working on your business, and not work on the relationship piece as well. You have to be clear about what you want. You know, who you are, what you want, what you qualify for, and what what you qualify for once, will you?

Kevin Anthony 51:06
Yes, absolutely. And that’s something I was sort of alluding to more in the beginning of the show when I was asking you about where is the line, right? Like, how do you know when because you’re right, you can’t spend 10 years or 20 years working solely on you know, your career, and then expect that you’re going to have any clue what to do when the relationship comes around? Because you put no practice in, you haven’t actually spent any time doing it.

Glenn Sandifer 51:31
Yeah, but the reality is, most people who spend 10 years in their career today, they’re not just focusing on a career, they have situation ships left and right, one every one new and every six months. And then they’re complaining about the relationship I’ve got. Well, you said you wanted to focus on your career. So why are you entertaining? It’s the word I use as entertaining. Are you entertaining yet? Entertaining are? Well, because, you know, I just need attention. You need attention from that. I was like, if you don’t go join a church league or join become a youth pastor or get involved in skee ball or something, go find a hobby? Did it give me getting attention from people unnecessarily and unwanted leads to both people being hurt? Those are two people that it impacts.

Kevin Anthony 52:17
You’re absolutely right. It creates carnage behind you with all those failed relationships. But it’s also teaching you bad habits that you will take into the next relationship that you’re the one that you really want to make work. And you’re not going to know how to do it. Because all you know, is all these failed relationships that you didn’t really put the proper time effort energy attention into.

So we are getting very close to the end of the show I want. I want you to tell the audience a little bit because you’ve mentioned it multiple times throughout the show. But we haven’t really talked about exactly what it is. So I wonder if you could tell the audience about what really is the middle ground.

Glenn Sandifer 53:00
So the middle ground, I actually came up with it as I was writing this book, this version of the book, which is a three-part book, by the way. It was called something else, I won’t release the name because just like artists, I may come out with it later. But I said what do I want people to take away? From my situation in this writing? What have I wanted everyone that I’ve coached? People that I interviewed for this book, what did I want them to take away, that it’s not going to be your way or the highway, it has to be the middle ground someone else. So the middle ground is the idea, the thought process, and the community around, making sure that the relationship outcome that you work is in one entrepreneur in your control, and doing the work necessary to reach that outcome.

Kevin Anthony 53:56
Yeah, that’s beautiful and fantastic. And, you know, maybe another way to sum it up is to know exactly what you want. Right? And make sure your partner knows what she or he wants, and then get on the same plan. Right? And make sure that you’re both supporting those goals that you want, right? Because a lot of what we talked about was, you know, okay, if he wants to be the CEO, and we’re talking about these, that the sixth type that we talked about the high value, and her whole thing was like okay, if you need me to work a little bit to help you or if you need me to hold it down while you go to school or any of those things like that’s working together as a team.

Glenn Sandifer 54:40
And so yeah, so that that that’s the middle ground, no exact NBA NFL Major League Baseball hockey player. So the big four gets it alone. No one in NASCAR who just that we just had the Daytona 500 NASCAR The driver doesn’t do it alone. The driver has a pit crew. He has a pit chief. He has four or five people on tires three on oil, three on diagnostics, a sponsor, and an owner. So everyone is pushing in the same direction of winning the Daytona 500. Everyone is doing everything that they can to get incrementally better to be prepared for that race. It’s the same thing in our relationships, and we know it in business, but we don’t apply it to the relationship. We believe business is going to take strategy. We think relationships should just happen. It should be easy. If it’s right. I mean, you know, one of my favorite artists, she says that on her song, she was like, I don’t think it’s right. I don’t think it’s supposed to be hard. As she was saying that tongue in cheek. I was like, You know what, that’s actually what I’m talking about in the book. She’s absolutely right. This is supposed to be easy. I’m not dealing with this anymore.

Kevin Anthony 55:50
Yeah, it is. It shouldn’t be easy if it’s right. But if it’s right, then you should also be doing all the things we talked about, right? So in other words, you don’t just come together and just kind of fly by the seat of your pants and wing it. And like somehow it magically works out. When it’s right, you’re motivated to do the things that you need to do. You get with this person and you’re like, wow, okay, this feels right. So, let’s sit down and work together as a team. Let’s plan it out.

Glenn Sandifer 56:22
You know, that’s not what we do. We say, oh, man, this feels right. ladies who are listening, would know this. We had such a really good conversation, and you know the chemistry, but I feel really comfortable around him. But six months later, you’re heartbroken because you didn’t do. You didn’t communicate your expectation. He didn’t provide you any leadership. And we repeat the cycle. And then we look, I don’t want people 38 looking around saying where’s my relationship? Where’s my happily ever after? It’s not that easy, guys. It is just like your job, it is just like your business. It takes strategy with intention, and realistic expectations to make things work.

Kevin Anthony 57:05
Powerful soundbite right there. Yes, you’re absolutely right. I love it. Okay, so we are pretty much out of time, I’ve got one more question for you. But before that, tell the listeners where they can find out more about you the middle ground, and how they can work with you if they want to hire you as a coach.

Glenn Sandifer 57:25
So I am available on the middle ground book.com. The website is up and it has access to our core four socials, you can follow us on Facebook, you can follow us on Tik Tok and YouTube as the middle ground book. And on Instagram, we’re middle ground book. for that. They’re on our website, you can book a coaching session, you can our coaching sessions, I believe are very reasonable for this season of the middle ground. And then you can also purchase the book in paperback form or you can download it. It can be downloaded on through audible for audiobook. It’s also available on Apple books, and Google Play Books as well.

Kevin Anthony 58:11
Awesome. I highly recommend it. If the book is anything like the conversation, then I recommend that people get it and read it. All right, one last question that we have asked every guest we’ve ever had on this show. And that is what is your best sexual talent?

Unknown Speaker 58:42
What’s the professional way to say it? Cunnilingus.

Kevin Anthony 58:49
All right. There you go. A great skill to have women always appreciate that. Thanks for being a good sport. You know, I mean, the show is about sex, love and relationship. Some episodes are very heavy on the sexual side, and some are much more on the relationship side. And so when we get people in who are you know, more from the professional relationship psychology side of things, that question always makes them a little uncomfortable.

Glenn Sandifer 59:16
I had to think about who’s gonna watch this. Is my mom gonna watch this?

Kevin Anthony 59:22
That’s right. All right. Well, hey, I thought that was a fascinating conversation. I thought there were some really, really great pieces of information in there that are so needed at this time and age that we’re living in. And I hope everybody listening got value out of it. And I would like to thank you, Glenn, for being on the show.

Glenn Sandifer 59:40
Thank you again. It’s been a pleasure. Thank you to your audience for the time. And if they don’t take anything away, make sure that they know you can have the relationship. You can have the business success that you want. It just takes you reaching the middle ground.

Kevin Anthony 59:57
All right, everybody. That’s all the time We have for this episode and I will see you next week.

We hope you liked this episode of the Love Lab podcast. If you enjoy this show, subscribe, leave us a review and share it with your friends.

Céline Remy 1:00:16
And for more free exclusive content. Join us in the passion vault at Célineremy.com/vault. That’s c e l i n e r e m y.com/vault.

Kevin Anthony 1:00:29
Thanks for listening.

Céline Remy 1:00:31
And remember, you’re amazing!