How To Build Your Dating Confidence

Kevin Anthony 0:11
Welcome to the Love Lab podcast a safe place to get real about sex. Whether you’re a man or woman, single or couple, this is the show for you.

Céline Remy 0:20
We are your hosts, Kevin Anthony and Céline Remy and we are here to guide you to go from good to amazing in the bedroom and beyond.

Kevin Anthony 0:27
All right, welcome back to the Love Lab podcast. This is episode 195. And it’s titled How To Build your dating confidence with Robbie Kramer. So we’re going to talk about a lot of things confidence is going to be a big piece of what we’re talking about what’s not the only thing we’re going to cover, because there’s a bunch of other sorts of interwoven ideas that go along with that.

Kevin Anthony 0:51
But you know, one of the things that I see a lot when coaching men is that honestly, they lack confidence. And while there have always been men who lacked confidence, especially in dating, I think it is an epidemic in today’s current modern society. And there’s a lot of reasons for that maybe we’ll get into those.

Kevin Anthony 1:12
I don’t know if we really will or not, and we might not really have time for that we might want to just stick with like, okay, what can you do about it, you know, but let’s just say there’s a lot of pressure on men to not be men. And when men do not step up and be men, they lack confidence.

Kevin Anthony 1:28
So we’re going to talk about all of that we’re gonna obviously have a guest on who’s going to help us with that. And I think it’s really going to be a fascinating conversation, because like I said, just a moment ago, I see so many men struggling with this.

Céline Remy 1:42
Yeah, today’s show is going to be geared towards the men in our audience. But I think that there’s always value if you are a woman, women to listen to that as well or share it with all of your male friends because I think it’s going to be very impactful episodes. But before we get started, let’s give a big shout-out to our sponsor’s power and mastery.

Céline Remy 2:02
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Kevin Anthony 2:23
That’ll give you some confidence in the bedroom.

Céline Remy 2:27
Let me introduce our guest. today. Our guest is Robby Kramer, he has been guiding men to accomplish their goals with women, health, fitness, and career since 2008. He founded inner confidence to show men exactly how to create the lifestyle of their dreams in a way that actually works.

Céline Remy 2:46
Robbie brings dignity and ease to traditionally taboo interactions, no funny names, no big gap routines, no fake stories, tricking women into liking you. Just a 100% real attraction. Thank you, Robbie. Robbie has worked personally with over 1000 clients on six continents. So welcome Robbie, to the Love Lab podcast.

Robbie Kramer 3:07
Thanks so much. Great to be here with you guys.

Kevin Anthony 3:10
Yeah, so I love that second, like two sentences of the bio there, which are no funny names. No pickup. No pickup routines, no fake stories, no tricky. So I’ve wanted to repeat that. Because when we’re talking about how to build confidence, right, and like men are gonna go out there and learn how to be confident.

Kevin Anthony 3:31
We’re not talking about all of that stuff, all of that crap that gets perpetuated out there over and over and over again. So if that’s what you thought you were gonna get, Nope,

Céline Remy 3:43
you’re going to get that stuff here. So you have something that you broke down into four dating archetypes. And I know that men can go take a quiz on your website, we’ll send them there too. But how about you describe a little bit maybe what they are so that our listeners can see where they stand?

Robbie Kramer 4:04
Sure. So the one that most guys will kind of find themselves in is this procrastination stage or archetype. And a lot of guys who are kind of using online dating as really the only thing to generate leads in their love life. It’s typically these guys, guys who aren’t going out and meeting the type of women they want. Guys who are complaining that they’re not getting enough dates.

Robbie Kramer 4:30
Anyone who’s kind of has a lack of abundance coming and usually, they’re procrastinating and if they really look in the mirror, and ask themselves, Am I doing the things that I should be doing to get more dates and define, you know, that women I really want? The answer is usually no, they’re not going after the women that they see. And maybe they’re at the bar.

Robbie Kramer 4:51
Do they approach that woman that they see at the bar? Probably not right? They tell themselves an excuse instead or do they see the approach the woman that’s giving them a cute little glance in the Starbucks probably not some excuse, oh, you know, I, I’m late for work or I don’t have my, you know, my best outfit on today. And those are primarily the guys that work with a lot of tech guys a lot of internet sort of guys.

Robbie Kramer 5:14
And it’s really hard to get out of that mindset when you’re, you’re kind of just hoping something will happen, but you’re not really taking any actions. So that’s kind of the first archetype. The other one is kind of that scripting guy who’s maybe read too much pickup advice. He’s going out and using tactics and techniques and kind of coming across as inauthentic. trying way too hard, at least he’s doing something right. And you got to pat him on the back for at least he’s going out there.

Robbie Kramer 5:42
So that’s number two. Number three is the guy who’s also taking some action, but he’s kind of just like winging it, you know, he’s like the guy who talks to every woman he sees, but he’s, he doesn’t have any real idea of what he’s doing. He might be going on a lot of dates, but not really, you know, ending up with any of the women he really wants, or he’s not succeeding on any of those dates, because he’s probably talking too much about himself making a whole bunch of conversational mistakes.

Robbie Kramer 6:09
This is the guy you see who’s kind of just like, blabbing the girl’s ear off in the bar, talking about how cool he is, and name-dropping and telling about his yacht or his boats. So that guy, you know, no one wants to kind of be around that guy, but they’re out there, especially in Miami. So that’s the guy is kind of like winging it.

Robbie Kramer 6:29
And last, the last archetype is someone who understands like, I call them a structure on my site, someone who has some sort of structure and a, an actual plan about their dating life, someone who knows what they’re going to do on a first date, they know how to quarterback a date, they know where to kind of move in interaction.

Robbie Kramer 6:49
Next, if they meet a woman at a bar, or a club, or a festival, they have sort of a roadmap or an idea in their mind of what to do in this area of their life. And usually those guys in any, you know, area of life get a lot of success. Like if you’re an internet marketer, you need to build a data funnel for that, right, if you’re a single man, and you’re looking to find an awesome woman, then you also need to build a dating funnel.

Robbie Kramer 7:15
And if you don’t think of it in those terms, you’re I think, leaving a lot of opportunities on the table. So that’s what I like to tell guys is to design an actual funnel, because that’s really what it is, if you’re out there, dating doesn’t matter. If you’re a man or a woman, you have a funnel of leads, and they’re coming in, and you’re trying to, you know, optimize and find the best fit. So if you have no idea what you’re doing, or you’re not taking a strategic approach to that, I don’t like your chances as much as someone who is,

Kevin Anthony 7:40
well, I love the idea of a dating funnel, I’m going to come back to that later. However, I want to go to the first archetype that you were just talking about, which procrastinator who broke craft and data. So, you know, if you’re going to take the majority of men, and you’re going to break them down and say, Okay, there’s four archetypes and everybody fits into one of these, for the most part, right?

Kevin Anthony 8:04
It’s not going to be a 25% 25% 25% 25% distribution, right? Like something, there gonna be some categories that have more men than others. One of the things that I see, you can tell me if you see this as well, Robbie, but one of the things that I see is most of the men I end up working with, tends to be in that first category. The procrastinator one, oh, yeah. That to me seems

Robbie Kramer 8:28
Like 70%, maybe 80%. And my experience,

Kevin Anthony 8:31
okay, so, so great. So you’re saying the same thing that I’m seeing, like, yeah, like that third archetype guy, like, Yeah, I’ve seen a few of those. But there aren’t nearly as many of those as there is the first type. So I’m curious. First, I want to break that down a little bit, because it is 70% of men, right? So like, there’s gonna be a lot of guys listening to this that realize that, oh, fuck, that’s me.

Céline Remy 8:54
I also want to maybe see where a guy who I mean, I think he fits in the procrastinator, but he might be thinking he’s doing a lot of action. But actually, he’s just making a lot of excuses, in my opinion, when I have written as the person doing, so would you put that person who’s like, Yeah, but I’m doing all of this, but they’re not responding to my staff, or it’s their fault. So this is what’s not going on? Like, where would you put that guy? That guy is

Robbie Kramer 9:21
like the guy who’s constantly on Tinder swiping and constantly having text message conversations that aren’t leading to dates. Like if you’re not getting dates, I would still call that in the procrastination stage. Because you’re you might be doing a lot of stuff, but it’s not. It’s not the stuff that’s actually going to move the needle, and you’re taking, you’re taking action, but it’s usually hiding behind the fear of rejection, rather than actually confronting and dealing with that fear of rejection, which will lead to results where the other stuff well,

Kevin Anthony 9:52
okay, so see now this is where this is the question that I was getting at, which is because that’s the majority of people because I have so many men asking like, well, I don’t know, how do I do this? And what do I do is like, what is the stuff that will help them move the needle? And what kind of behaviors? So it’s kind of two parts, what stuff is really going to move the needle? And what stuff are they doing that’s really useless that they think is moving the needle, but really isn’t?

Robbie Kramer 10:20
So great question, the first thing, and this are what I was doing. So and this is why I got into this whole thing was, I was what I called an inauthentic, nice guy. And what that meant was the way that I thought to attract women was to make extra copies of my homework in class and pass it out to the cute girls, or do favors for women, or hope that they would see me as a sexual, you know, sort of man by just being nice.

Robbie Kramer 10:49
And it was authentically nice because I was trying to get sex. But, you know, what I was presenting wasn’t like, here’s my real authentic sexual self, I was terrified of actually telling a woman I was interested or sexually attracted to her. Not that I’m saying you should walk around the street and say, I’m sexually attracted.

Kevin Anthony 11:11
But work occasionally might get laughs.

Robbie Kramer 11:15
But if I liked the girl, I wouldn’t, I would be like, embarrassed about it, I wouldn’t admit it. A lot of the time, I missed out on so many opportunities in high school, I remember, girls would write in my yearbook like I had such a big crush on you, I wish you would have done something. And I’m like, Oh, my God, I had a crush on her too. But I did nothing because of the fear of rejection.

Robbie Kramer 11:34
And that is so many guys that and because of that fear of rejection or that fear of that embarrassment of our attraction, that’s kind of the better way to say we’re embarrassed about our attraction, we don’t know how to express our attraction in a way that is attractive, right? Either we, we wait until, you know, we’re deep in the friendzone. And finally, we have to, we have to admit that we’re interested, and then the whole thing blows up.

Robbie Kramer 12:00
And that’s yourself out of that one. Oh, man. Yeah. Or, or we’re the guy who’s, you know, driving down the street catcalling, because that’s the only way we know how to express our attraction. And neither of those things work very well at all. So back to your question. So that is the what did you ask exactly? What are the sorts of the ways or

Kevin Anthony 12:24
let’s first cover the things that guys think are working and moving the needle. But really, you’re just a waste of time and an excuse?

Robbie Kramer 12:30
Right? Okay, so if you’re doing that, right, and if you’re, if you got this kind of nice guy syndrome going, then you’re probably only using online dating. And you’re hiding behind your profile, you’re hoping you get some matches. And the nice thing about online dating is obviously if you swipe right, and they swipe right, it’s somewhat assumed that you’re attracted to each other, at least on the photos on the page.

Robbie Kramer 12:54
But it’s so rare that guys succeed very much using online dating, and less there really tall, really good looking, and have very good texting communication skills. So like the guys who are doing well online are usually doing well everywhere. And that’s the majority of guys I see they’re struggling are there, they’re only using online dating only using Tinder. And they’re not getting the dates with the quality of women that they want.

Robbie Kramer 13:21
They’re always disappointed with the sort of dates that they’re getting. And they’re too afraid to ever sort of make a move or show intent or interest to the women in their life, or a woman walking down the street. So what you can do is the first thing you can do is you can start to break down this fear of rejection. And so I call it social freedom and also approaching people in, in real life.

Robbie Kramer 13:47
And this is what I did that really transformed my dating life. So at first, I had this crazy fear that you know, strangers would judge me, they’d think I was, you know, unattractive, or weird or whatever. And so I had this sort of fear of just kind of being out socially and, and expressing myself. So to get over that I did a bunch of silly exercises like nice laid down on the sidewalk, and a busy street until someone was worried that I was dead or sick.

Robbie Kramer 14:20
I would have to like go up to McDonald’s and ask for discounts. Crazy stuff like that. Just things that would make me feel awkward intentionally in public. I did another exercise where I talked to 100 people and as fast as I could like, just in a busy, kind of like a Venice Beach, Santa Monica boardwalk area, just talk to as many people in the shortest amount of time it could and I did all these things to kind of break down these this fear of rejection, the social fear that I had.

Robbie Kramer 14:48
And then what I started doing was approaching women that I found attractive. And that was the hardest part like walking up to a beautiful woman and just saying, Hey, I think you’re cute. And I’m going to run away now because I don’t know what to say. that, that actually made a huge difference. And one that I have a whole sort of series of steps to that you can do to get over that approach anxiety.

Robbie Kramer 15:13
But that is the biggest thing that will make a difference is actually start approaching people that you’re attracted to in real life. And you’d be shocked how easy it is to get a date, and the return on time versus what your what most guys are doing, which is, you know, not really much using online dating, and I get I I’ve got a whole elevator pitch on how to approach someone like happy to share. But hopefully, that answers your question.

Kevin Anthony 15:38
Yeah, it does. And, you know, I’m really glad to see that you’re giving the advice to tell people to actually go out and participate in life and not sit behind the screen? Because right now everything is being every literally everything’s getting being funneled towards the metaverse, right. Like this is where the push is right. And my advice has always been to clients that I’ve coached is, you know, there’s nothing wrong with online dating. But, you know, every date I’ve ever gotten pretty much has been because I went out and I just did stuff. And I met people while I was doing stuff,

Céline Remy 16:16
because you didn’t really have an option by 10 to do online dating. Tell the truth. Kevin, dating you a little bit saying I’m old. But no, that’s not what I said.

Kevin Anthony 16:26
Well, I will tell you this I did once build a profile because I thought I was going to try on it and it was like an I think it was like Yahoo dating or something that that that’s how old that is. No, but the point is, I love the fact that you know, yes, okay, use the technology because it technology is helpful. But also don’t forget to go out and live life, do stuff, meet people talk to people.

Kevin Anthony 16:52
The other point that you made that I really liked was that basically, you’re giving advice on how to get over that fear. Because honestly, as a guy, it doesn’t really matter. It doesn’t matter how good-looking you are, how much money you have all of those things. If you’re not an what we would kind of call an A-type personality, then walking straight up to a complete stranger. You know, a woman who’s beautiful, and asking her out is a very difficult thing for most men to do. It’s just it most guys will not do it. Yeah, 100. Well,

Robbie Kramer 17:25
even even, you know, I speak to Navy SEALs I’ve coached who have been like, I would rather go into battle. That woman I find attractive. And obviously, we get them over that very quickly. But that’s a real fear. It’s like a real primal fear that’s built-in. So

Kevin Anthony 17:42
yeah, really I would say the only guy that’s consistently going up there is that third archetype that you described he’s the guy that’s consistently going up and asking every time right. Other than that, probably everybody else is struggling with that same thing of like, Ooh, how do I go ask her? What do I do?

Céline Remy 18:00
So I wanted to ask you because it’s kind of connection with what you were sharing here. What do you have to say to those who aren’t attracted to the woman they’re dating, and in the West, because they’re settling, right? And think they can get a date with a woman that they truly want?

Céline Remy 18:19
And, you know, I kind of see some self-sabotage pattern. And this is something that was going on with a client of mine, but I’m curious about your opinion on what do you do what he’s like, he’s telling me well, I ended up dating this woman, but I really want to be dating that woman over there, but it’s not happening. She’s like, everybody’s telling me that she’s out of my league. And I’m like, What the fuck is that? Like? It’s crazy thinking.

Robbie Kramer 18:46
Yeah, I mean, as it’s like if you believe it, then it’s a true sort of thing. I mean, I used to, I used to have that too. I used to sort of date women that I felt like I could get, but they weren’t the ones I really wanted. So then I ended up feeling I felt feeling like I was settling in the relationship, which ultimately ruined it for me, which was just a totally sabotaging ridiculous plan.

Robbie Kramer 19:12
But so many of us do that. Right. It’s like, there are the people, we think we, we, you know, we want but we really, I don’t think we can get them. So I’ll just settle for this person and then break up with them later and just do the same thing.

Kevin Anthony 19:28
Ooh, that is a pretty nasty pattern.

Robbie Kramer 19:31
And I think the way to get over that is there’s some story that you’re running in your head, which is I’m not good enough for XYZ. Because of this. For me it was I’m not good enough because I’m overweight. I used to be like 30 to 40 pounds heavier. And I lost the weight and I still had the story but at least now I didn’t have an excuse to not approach the women I really want it.

Robbie Kramer 19:55
Then once I started approaching them and meeting them through my social circle and friends then it worked out, then I started actually dating the ones I wanted. But I, you know, it really helped to pinpoint, like, what is that story in my mind I’m to XYZ and then eliminate the story. You

Kevin Anthony 20:12
know, I like a point that you made, which is that you know, used to be heavier, and then you lost the way. And so, you know, another thing that I often and I know something, you teach the same thing, but it’s like when you have a guy who’s coming to you and saying, Well, you know, I can’t get this woman because I’m not this or I’m not that or I’m not the other thing, you know, one of the big pieces of advice is then become that thing, become the type of man that that woman would date.

Kevin Anthony 20:40
That’s, that’s one of the things that we tell men all the time. And I liked that you shared that because that’s basically what you did, you’re like, Okay, I’m insecure about my weight. So I’m going to lose weight. Now, granted, there was a mental component where you still had to kind of get over the programming in the story from before, but you took action to do something to become that man that you wanted to become that you thought would have a better chance?

Robbie Kramer 21:02
Totally, you know, because we all probably have reasons why we’re not at the top of whatever thing that we’re doing, right? And if we can eliminate those reasons, then we eliminate the story. And we can, you know, there’s an opportunity there. So exactly what you said.

Robbie Kramer 21:18
And if there’s no excuse for not losing that weight, there’s no excuse for not upgrading yourself and always that you can write if you think you deserve a quote-unquote 10 You better attend to.

Céline Remy 21:31
And curious, what did you learn from your social experiment of laying down the street and stuff? Like, were you surprised by how people responded? Or how do people have little literally care? Is that what happened? Or how much do they care? Like, what did you find?

Robbie Kramer 21:49
What was really interesting for me was, yeah, people didn’t care. They were too everyone’s too busy worrying about themselves really caring about you. And, and all the anxiety and fear. After doing these sorts of things, approaching women doing things to make yourself embarrassed, it transforms from anxiety to excitement, and you actually get excited to do it.

Robbie Kramer 22:11
Like after approaching about 30 to 50 women, I had tons of anxiety in my body, every time I would do it, I’d walk up, I’d be sweating by like my words would not I bought blabbermouth, whatever. And then once I kind of did, like 50, in a pretty short period of time, as it took me maybe like a week to do 50. And I was doing it consistently every day. It started feeling like excitement versus anxiety like you’re excited to get on a roller coaster.

Robbie Kramer 22:39
If you’ve been on some roller coasters before you’re scared to death if you’ve never been on one as a little kid. And that’s what transforms. And that makes a huge difference. Because now, the nonverbal communication is one of someone who’s confident, you know, having fun expressing those good emotions versus expressing those anxious not so good ones?

Céline Remy 22:59
Well, it’s interesting you mentioned that because remember, we had Michelle, the other day on our show, with her book out of touch. And in it, she did mention that most people mistake feeling anxious for being in love. Those feelings that we feel at first are very similar to anxiety. But you can reframe them like remember the climber who was calling it pre joy, rather,

Kevin Anthony 23:26
rather than pain and suffering, he was calling it Precure. So there are ways around

Céline Remy 23:31
to retrain your mind. But it’s funny you mentioned that because, in a sense, you were still having some similar emotional responses or bodily responses. But rather than being like, I’m frozen by this anxiety that it’s this holds me back from doing anything I can do like, well, this is kind of exciting to have this, this anxiety, but still move forward. So it’s just fascinating what we can do once we set our mind to it.

Robbie Kramer 23:57
Yeah, it really is, like, you know, fear is a huge motivator, and could also be a huge, you know, stopping thing. But if you let it stop you then you do but there are ways to really manage that. Like, if you’re totally afraid to, like, if you’re listening to this, and the next time you see a cute girl walk over to say, Hey, I think you’re really cute. I’m gonna run away now and run away, right?

Robbie Kramer 24:21
That’d be fun, then great. If you think you can do that, and you go out and you realize, I can’t do that. That’s way too terrifying. Just, instead of doing that next time you see a beautiful woman, just position yourself in a position where you could talk to her, but give yourself permission to not talk to her. Because I’m sure we can do that.

Robbie Kramer 24:43
And that’s kind of the very important thing because if you’re going to talk to someone, you want to be in a good position, and you want to have good body language and you want that communication to be confident versus not. So positioning is very important when it comes to approaching people. So that’s a great stuff that people can do to practice if they have a lot of anxiety that’s stopping them in the first place. Do you

Céline Remy 25:05
have another thing too, that they can say? I’ve asked a woman. I’m gonna say that the having people coming to you and say, Oh, you’re beautiful. You’re beautiful. I heard it many times, I kind of was like, Okay, do you have something more original? Because you know, it gets boring. If you are somebody who’s considered beautiful. Trust me, it’s like, kind of annoying after a while. So I’m putting you on the spot here. Robbie, I’m

Robbie Kramer 25:31
glad you asked. I’m really glad. Yes. So So yes, I tell my clients that if you’re going to approach someone on the street, or in a Starbucks, or in a venue where it’s not socially acceptable to approach, then you really need a reason why you’re doing it, right. Like if someone’s at a bar or a festival, and it’s a social environment, you can just walk up to them and say, Hey, how’s your night going?

Robbie Kramer 25:55
That’s totally fine, right? But if you’re gonna run after someone walking down the sidewalk in New York City, who’s booking is going to work? You can’t just ask them like, Hey, do you know where the Starbucks is? They’re gonna go check your phone, asshole. Like,

Kevin Anthony 26:08
especially if you’re in New York, that’s exactly what they’ll say.

Robbie Kramer 26:11
Yeah. So, my strategy when it comes to approaching women in that sort of environment is to be flirty, and also direct. Because first, you know, you only have half a second for her to realize, like, is this a homeless person? Are they begging? Are they trying to get up for you know, save the whales? Like, what do they want? And what do they want? That’s what we all want it? What are they? What do they want? And are they dangerous?

Robbie Kramer 26:38
Those are kind of the two questions you’re asking yourself, right? So what I tell guys is you need to quickly explain what you’re doing. And show her that you have social awareness. Because if you have no social awareness, then people are gonna think you’re crazy. So what I usually do, is I use a flirty sort of direct, honest, it’s not even a line.

Robbie Kramer 26:57
It’s just kind of calling out what I’m doing. I’ll say, Hey, I saw you and I had to risk embarrassing the hell out of myself to meet you. You look super busy. You’re like totally walking fast. I’m in a rush to I gotta go to a meeting. How about this? I’d love to stay in chat. Obviously. No time. Give me your number. You don’t like me? Give me a fake one.

Céline Remy 27:16
I love that. See, I love this. This is what’s awesome. Robbie, I hope everybody wrote it down, please rewind, like leads on the podcast and we Brian write it down. Then it becomes a pickup line though.

Kevin Anthony 27:26
And you even gave her permission to give you a fake one. So if you get home and it’s a fake one, you can’t be mad. Okay,

Robbie Kramer 27:35
it is a line. It’s definitely a line. But no one’s gonna ever call you out on using it as a line. Because there’s it’s not like a cheesy line right there. Like you’re just basically being honest and telling her what you’re doing.

Kevin Anthony 27:45
Are your legs tired? Because you’ve been running through my mind all night? Well, that’s what we

Robbie Kramer 27:56
Are those space pants that ass is out of this world?

Kevin Anthony 28:02
Boy, we should do a whole episode just on bad pickup lines. Okay, is there anything you wanted to add to that last because I think you’re gonna say one more thing?

Robbie Kramer 28:13
So that’s just a great little, you know, elevator pitch that you could use that tomorrow, you could approach 10 beautiful women. And I bet if you do that and if you’re dressed halfway decent, and you have you know, some level of competence you’re already doing, okay? Even if you’re not great. One out of 10, you’re probably going to get a date. Like, you know, that’s not a huge number.

Robbie Kramer 28:37
But that’s way better than what you’re going to do swiping on Tinder way better. And it’s going to take way less time to get that one date. Because each of those approaches takes 30 seconds, maybe a minute, right, that’s 10 minutes. And I’m not you know, you can try to go out and do this. Or you can just do it to the next 10 Beautiful women you see.

Robbie Kramer 28:54
But I promise if you’re listening to this and you do that, not you know, you might get a number, you might get a date, but what you will get for sure is a lot of confidence and a huge sort of transformation of what you think is possible and how people receive you. Like, you might think women are going to respond poorly to that you’re never going to get a bad reaction. If you don’t stop or correctly, you might get ignored, but that’s about the worst thing that’s gonna happen.

Céline Remy 29:21
I would agree with that.

Kevin Anthony 29:21
Okay, I really want to get back to this idea of a funnel, but I think we should do our ad, and then we’ll get into a funnel. All right.

Céline Remy 29:30
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Céline Remy 29:56
So go check out the store at Céline remy.com forward slash products, and you might just find exactly what you need to keep you juicy moving on, all final things exactly come from confidence to juiciness in the bedroom.

Kevin Anthony 30:16
Okay, so I know, at the beginning of this interview, you mentioned this idea of a funnel. Now, you know, people that aren’t online marketers or don’t run their own business and don’t understand what a funnel is. Basically, what it means is, that rather than having only one source of inputs into your machine, you’ve got multiple sources. So you think of it as a funnel, right?

Kevin Anthony 30:39
A funnel takes a big wide amount of something and focuses it into a small amount of something, right? So I’ve never actually thought about applying that theory to dating. But obviously, you have, I think this could be extremely valuable for listeners to reframe how they think about how they meet people. So because that’s always the thing, you know, people are well, I don’t know how to meet people. Okay, well, now you’re going to explain to them, what is a dating funnel? What kind of things would be in it? How would they possibly create one?

Robbie Kramer 31:13
Sure, so there’s really going to be four of those inputs. And I love your way of describing a funnel. I’m glad you didn’t ask me because I’m gonna, like put water in it. But yeah, so there’s gonna be like, four main ways that that woman is going to come into your life as a man who’s obviously dating.

Robbie Kramer 31:32
So the first way is through your social circle, or your friends, your family, people you already know. And that’s the best way to meet someone. Right? Like, because you have that third party, that third party validation, right? Like, if I say to, you know, Céline, my buddy, Kevin, he’s the man, you’re probably and you think I’m cool? Kevin’s in right, there’s no better way to like,

Céline Remy 31:56
he’s in all right.

Robbie Kramer 32:03
So that’s, that’s the best way. And most people who don’t have a really active dating life, it’s partly due because their social circle isn’t bringing in a lot of leads, either their friends are all married, or they don’t go out, or they just don’t have a lot of like rainmakers in their social circle.

Robbie Kramer 32:21
So that’s a big part of the process is surround yourself with friends wingman, if you’re a guy, other people who are single and active and doing cool stuff because then you’re going to meet people organically through that social circle, which is the best way. The next way, which I would recommend is what we just talked about, which is going out and talking to people in real life.

Robbie Kramer 32:42
So going to social events, and having the courage to approach the people you find attractive, right? Because they’re not going to approach you very often. Unless you’re Brad Pitt. And even then, they’re still probably not going to approach you, right. So you have to you know, that’s really where the rubber meets the road. Because you don’t have to have a social circle. That’s, that’s kicking ass.

Robbie Kramer 33:01
Because any guy can do this, it doesn’t matter. You know, how tall you are, what you look like, you can go and do this. There’s nothing stopping it. So you can do that in social environments, which are like I said, bars, clubs, festivals, and places where it’s normal to meet people. But some people are more introverted, and they don’t like those sorts of things.

Robbie Kramer 33:21
And if that’s you, then you’re kind of stuck to the grocery store, walking down the sidewalk, Starbucks, and the sort of like daytime venues I was talking about, and you can use that elevator pitch I mentioned. And then you have online dating, that’s kind of like the others.

Robbie Kramer 33:37
There are meeting people in social events such as meeting people, and non-social events approaching them. There are social circles, and there’s online dating. And if you’re only using online dating, which most people are doing, that’s a really shitty funnel, you’re missing out on three other better options there.

Céline Remy 33:54
You know, it’s funny, because we were talking, we just had some, we had somebody from OkCupid. That was on our show not too long ago. And so we’ve been talking about online dating, and I was telling Kevin that I wish I had an app, where you couldn’t just see the people’s picture, where you were just like, read who they are.

Céline Remy 34:13
And then maybe after you like what they wrote, or like, how they presented themselves with words, you could see their photo, because I think that’s when we judge too quickly with the photo. We were just talking with a friend yesterday. And she was like, well if a guy has no hair, I just swiped the other direction. And I was thinking, you know, is it my preference to have somebody who doesn’t have hair?

Céline Remy 34:34
No. Would that stop me from dating somebody? No, absolutely not. And I thought how sucky Is it because a lot of men do go bold, you know, and it sucks. Like there’s nothing you can do. See, I mean, I’m, I would be much more okay with no hair than overweight. Because no hair, there’s nothing you can do about it overweight. Well, there are a lot of things you can do, right?

Céline Remy 34:57
So just like seeing this whole idea that the photo sometimes we get so hung up on like how one person looks or how this is one thing we don’t like, or we don’t want, and then we just miss out on great opportunities. So if you are a shorter man who’s bald, you’re going to want to do Robbie strategy in terms of having a social circle and asking people, you know, like, just to say hello.

Céline Remy 35:21
And I think especially nowadays with post-pandemic like people crave connection, I love it. Now, I’m an introvert. And I love it when people come and talk to me at the grocery store, because like, Oh, finally talking to somebody, this is amazing. social distancing, you know, so actually, it’s never been better to approach somebody, I think,

Robbie Kramer 35:42
Oh, totally. Yeah. And you’re, you’re like the perfect, you know, testimonial for a beautiful woman who actually, you know, if you get approached in alike, in a good way, it’s so flattering. Women love that, like, no one wants to be approached by an asshole, or by someone who’s, who’s rude.

Robbie Kramer 36:00
But even if you’re married, or whatever, like it’s gonna make your day. So the worst thing that you’re going to do as a guy is you’re gonna make a bunch of women’s dates. So

Céline Remy 36:08
that is so true. I would have a big smile on my face, I come home to my husband and be like, Hey, this is what happened. That was awesome. And the guy built his confidence because he talked to somebody he thought was beautiful, and who had a smile from her. So

Kevin Anthony 36:21
you’re great. No, I gotta escort you to the grocery store. Okay, all of this talk about online dating actually brings us to one of our questions, which is, you know, how is it that men, a lot of men, at least anyway, are using online dating incorrectly? Because it is one of the four ways and it’s probably one of the ones even though it’s not the most effective? It’s one of the probably the most common ones used? So maybe you could give the listeners some advice like, what are you doing wrong in the online dating world?

Robbie Kramer 36:54
Good question. Well, the biggest online dating site and the most important online dating site is actually Instagram. Because everything flows through Instagram these days, right? You meet someone on Tinder, you meet someone on OKCupid, right? It’s like, what do you do you exchanged numbers, or you can exchange Instagrams and if you get someone’s Instagram, you’re gonna learn a lot more about them than if you just get their number.

Robbie Kramer 37:18
So if you’re a guy, and you don’t have at least a halfway decent Instagram profile, you are really cutting the odds out of your favor. And I see that time and time again, as guys will be doing online dating a lot. And they’ve got like, one old picture on their Instagram. And I’m like, bro, like, Are you kidding me?

Robbie Kramer 37:37
You’re, you’re missing out on like, every hot woman out there because there are no hot women out there who are like, you know, especially if they’re younger, and like the early 20s, you don’t have Instagram, like you’re fucking weird. I’m sorry. Right? That’s like, a good

Kevin Anthony 37:51
thing. I’m married. I don’t even have an Instagram account.

Robbie Kramer 37:58
I mean, if you’re, if you’re older, obviously, it’s not as much of a thing. But you know, under like, 30 know, Instagram, you’re really fighting an uphill battle, or even Instagram that isn’t optimized, you’re fighting an uphill battle, because that’s, you know, a lot of women even on Tinder, they almost just use Tinder as a way to hope guys will kind of slide into their DMS.

Robbie Kramer 38:21
And, you know, they’ll say, if you if I swiped right on you, if you swipe right on me, just DM me on Instagram, because they’re not gonna go out with anyone who doesn’t have an Instagram. So that’s, and obviously what goes into making a good Instagram is kind of the same that what goes into making a good online dating profile, you need to, you know, high-quality photos, you want to look your best you want to know, like.

Robbie Kramer 38:41
If you’re gonna use online dating, it’s unfortunate, but you kind of got to know the angles of your face, you have to know what you know what direction you look better, when are you more masculine, when you’re looking at the camera, or smiling or kind of looking to the side off in the distance, like, these little tiny things make a huge difference.

Robbie Kramer 38:58
Because we’re talking about something where you’re judged like that, you know, and that’s the beauty of meeting people in real life is you can show your personality, your confidence, your humor, your wit, but you don’t get to do that online, you only have a photo.

Robbie Kramer 39:12
And like the blink of an eye where people are just, you know, its attention is like the currency these days, right? And if you don’t grab their attention, it’s gonna be really tough. So, you know, a lot of thought and effort really needs to go into your online dating profile if you want to succeed.

Kevin Anthony 39:32
That is fascinating. You know, we’ve talked about online dating a number of times on this show, including having people from the online dating services on, and never has it come up that you need to have an Instagram but I will tell you this. I’m not saying that. That is because I don’t think that you’re correct.

Kevin Anthony 39:52
Actually like a light bulb went off in my head when you said that because what I do have obligating myself again, the only social media account I have is Facebook, because I just whatever, I couldn’t care less about the rest. But here’s the thing. Facebook has stories across the top right? Those stories are actually Instagram stories that show up across there.

Kevin Anthony 40:13
And I can tell you that every single time I go onto Facebook, every single one of those stories across the top of my Facebook is a beautiful young woman. Every single one, I know that I’ve got plenty of male contacts, friends, whatever you want to call them in there that it could be showing me. But it doesn’t. It always shows me all the young hot women.

Robbie Kramer 40:38
Worse. Yeah. I mean, Facebook is the owner of Instagram, of course. So you know, it’s, it’s they’ve kind of merged them into one. But yeah, depending on your demographic. And I think it’s great that you don’t use social media because you know, I’m engaged. And every minute I spend on social media, I feel like I’m wasting a minute of my life. But if you’re single, and you know, you’re not optimizing those channels, it’s, you know, you’re really doing yourself a disservice.

Robbie Kramer 41:05
Because that’s like, if you’re a beautiful woman, and you have the option to date whoever you want, right? Like, most, most beautiful women don’t even use online dating, because why would they? They meet so many cool, like, awesome dudes through their social circle, or through just in real life that for they to resort to online dating.

Robbie Kramer 41:28
It’s very for a really short period of time, usually right after they’ve gone through a breakup, where their grandma says, you know, you should get on J date, you need a nice Jewish relationship. And that’s literally how I met. You know, I’ve dated a lot of women. But the one that I found online who was really beautiful was that exact scenario where she was only on J day of joy.

Robbie Kramer 41:52
She was only at J date for like a week she went on like three other dates. She’s like, all these guys are lame. And then we met and, and that was it. And you know, we were dating and she was off the platform. So, you know, if you’re really looking for, you know, the top quality women just know that they don’t need to use online dating. They’re only using it for validation.

Robbie Kramer 42:11
You know, they’ve got a profile, they’ll read the messages, and they’ll feel good that they’re getting messages and it’s like, Oh, yay, validation is great. But will they go on a date? Like, are they going to say yes, to your date? Maybe they’ll say yes, but if they have a date lined up with you, or with another guy that they’ve met in real life, they’re definitely going to meet that guy in real life over the guy they met online, because the guy you met online, you just don’t know nearly as much about that guy.

Robbie Kramer 42:38
And, you know, Céline you could, you could, you know, refute or back me up on that. Like, that’s, that’s kind of what I’ve heard from most beautiful women on.

Céline Remy 42:48
I would agree with some of our friends who are dating and are beautiful women. And there’s also this terrible thing for being online when you considered beautiful is like the some of them she was getting, like over 100 messages in a day. And she’s like, it’s just too overwhelming. You know, like, there’s just too much. So for sure, you’ll stand out. If you do something different and just don’t go in the same direction, then everybody is always going.

Céline Remy 43:18
So I kind of wants to wrap this up a little bit. There have been so many awesome advice and action steps that people can take from forcing themselves to take action on things that you think are scary, whatever that is that are uncomfortable just to learn, you know, some of the things that you do a lot to and when you go to some different like sex parties or events that are like Tantra things you learn to say like to say no and you go around the room and you’ll have to always say no, and people ask you things like”

Céline Remy 43:48
Can I touch your hair?” No, thank you to learn that it’s okay to say no, you know, and what you learn is that the more you say no, the easier it will become so that when you aren’t in that playtime and somebody comes like Can I play with you? And you’re like, I don’t feel like it. It’s like no thank you and you move on

Kevin Anthony 44:02
and that exercise teaches two things. So one it’s empowering you to say no if you’re not a no but it’s also teaching the other people to be okay when somebody says no to you,

Céline Remy 44:13
that has nothing to do with you. It’s just not the rights that is

Kevin Anthony 44:16
which is a little bit more like what we’ve been discussing right if you’re going to be a guy and you’re lacking confidence you got to get okay with the fact that some women are just gonna say no the reason they didn’t like the color your shirt like whatever, you know

Céline Remy 44:29
they’re menstruating that day yeah.

Kevin Anthony 44:33
Have their morning coffee. Yeah, you know, like whatever it is.

Robbie Kramer 44:37
There’s so much power in no you know, I actually read a really good sales book recently was called start with no and you know, sales dating it’s very similar we’re talking about funnels and all that stuff.

Robbie Kramer 44:49
So I highly recommend that book for anyone whether they’re in sales or not because everything is sales but it starts with no it literally starts with a no because people who are like, Hey, can you do this XYZ everyone’s like No, right? But if you get them to start with a no, it can be, you know, a lot easier to then get to a yes.

Céline Remy 45:08
That’s good. So practice the nose, do the crazy things you’re afraid off. Don’t be afraid to like put yourself out there revamp your Instagram, create a funnel create a funnel. Oh hmm. Is there anything I know that you had a few I want to address maybe quickly around the texting tips because you were saying that guys really make big, big mistakes when it comes to texting? Since we live in this technology world? What do you have to say about that? How to avoid some of the biggest mistakes when it comes to texting?

Robbie Kramer 45:41
Great question. So the biggest mistake guys make with texting or any sort of online communication. This is obviously online dating, in a nutshell, it’s just messaging back and forth, is when they do get the contact info of a woman that they’re really interested in is they over-communicate. And they kill all the mystery.

Robbie Kramer 46:00
They kill all the desire. They’re constantly messaging them like all day, every day, how you doing, but like conversations that would work face to face don’t work through messaging very well. Like when you ask someone how you do it over text is kind of annoying, like, I’m good. How about you? It’s like, you’ve really got to type that out. It’s

Kevin Anthony 46:18
so true. It’s so fucking true.

Robbie Kramer 46:23
So, you know, less is more, right? Like when if I’m going to use Tinder, and I have a whole like Tinder guide and away you can just like met optimize the efficiency of that. But once I get off Tinder, either on Instagram or onto WhatsApp or, or iMessage or whatever, I’m only going to be exchanging maybe four to eight messages tops before you know and then I’m getting going for a date.

Robbie Kramer 46:50
That and that’s the absolute most and texting, the only point of texting is to see someone again, right? Like, there’s no point in having a conversation. Because you want to do that in person, right? Unless she’s really like initiating the conversation. And, you know, seeking rapport with you, of course, you want to respond, you don’t want to be an asshole and just like, No,

Céline Remy 47:13
five times this is it, you’ve reached your quota women.

Robbie Kramer 47:18
You know, it’d be a robot, of course, but less is more. And if the way to tell this is just to look at, like do the bubble test, right? If the amount of text and the number of messages is pretty equal, you’re probably doing okay. But if there’s this severe investment misbalance, either on one side or the other, the person who’s investing more is more interested in probably too interested in losing the other party.

Kevin Anthony 47:42
I like that the bubble test. Yeah, that that is that’s actually very, very similar advice that Melissa, hopefully, from OkCupid gave us in a previous interview as well about the whole texting thing is like you basically her advice was, you know, if you’re having this whole long, you know, exchange, and you haven’t yet scheduled the date, then that’s not good. So yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly. So it’s like, a few backs and forth to establish some rapport and maybe figure out some plans. And then you should be going for the data

Céline Remy 48:18
from the data, say when you pick her up? And that’s that? Totally. Yeah. Awesome. Awesome. So tell before we ask you a very last question, tell our listeners where they can find more about you. And I know you said you have all these guides and things that they can get. So there’s so much more so where did they go?

Robbie Kramer 48:38
Sure. So if you go over to my website, it’s inner confidence.com, enter, like I N E R commerce.com. And what I’d recommend is if you’re struggling with texting, or you’re struggling with the messaging on Tinder, I have a texting guide that basically solves all of these questions for you. It’s just like, literally go to the chapter, what message I need to send, okay, you can cut and paste a lot of this stuff.

Robbie Kramer 49:02
Not all it’s not like canned lines or anything, but it’s super effective guys who use it, they’re like, wow, I just solved that whole thing that was gonna be so much stress because that’s where most guys get stuck. So that’s what I would recommend for any guide, regardless of the kind of where you’re at every guy can really improve their electronic communication. So yeah, find me on intercom.com, and love to help anyone out. Awesome.

Céline Remy 49:25
So we come to our very last question, Robbie. We want to know, what is your best sexual talent?

Robbie Kramer 49:31
Ooh, wasn’t expecting this question. Can I tell a little backstory to this? Sure. So I was at a sex party many years ago, maybe in 2013. And my girlfriend at the time. You know, we had tried to make her squirt before but no such luck. I never really knew what I was doing with that. But We’re with another couple and we were playing and this guy just like Wallah.

Robbie Kramer 50:04
And all of a sudden she was squirting like a fountain. And I was like, Holy shit, like, how did you do that? And he literally showed me how to do it on his wife. And the technique was so like, easy once he kind of like showed me what to do with my actual hand, where now I can get like, I don’t know, I’d say 75% of women to squirt if I have the opportunity. So it’s kind of a crowd favorite. You know, everyone loves a good squirting sort of show whether they’re having an orgasm or not. It’s definitely one of them you know, like a cool parlor trick and a sex

Kevin Anthony 50:41
Definitely is a crowd-pleaser.

Céline Remy 50:43
Exactly when no one’s gonna think. That’s a cool talent to see. Now we’re gonna have to have Robbie back on the show because people like, I want to see the technique. Well, if you want to know this technique, and how to do it, you can find it too at sexual mastery and power and power and mastery.com for sure. But I’m sure Robbie has good things too. But that is awesome. Awesome. Robbie, thank you so much for being here today with us and for all the wonderful advice that you’ve shared. It’s been such a great conversation.

Robbie Kramer 51:15
Yeah, guys, I love this interview. It’s so much fun. Thanks so much.

Kevin Anthony 51:18
All right, everybody. That’s all the time we have for this episode. And we will see you next week. We hope you liked this episode of the Love Lab podcast. If you enjoy this show, subscribe. Leave us a review and share it with your friends.

Céline Remy 51:36
And for more free exclusive content. Join us in the passion vault at kevinanthonycoaching.com/vault.

Kevin Anthony 51:51
Thanks for listening. And remember,

Céline Remy 51:52
you’re amazing