The Real Reason Your Relationships Fail

Kevin Anthony 0:11
Welcome to the love lab podcast a safe place to get real about sex. Whether you’re a man or woman, single or couple, this is the show for you.

Céline Remy 0:20
We are your hosts, Kevin Anthony and Celine Remy. And we are here to guide you to go from good to amazing in the bedroom and beyond.

Kevin Anthony 0:28
Alright, welcome back to the love lab podcast. This is Episode 167. And it’s titled The real reason your relationships fail. So we’ve covered actually quite a few reasons why relationships fail. But that’s because there are a lot of reasons. Some of them are pretty obvious. Some of them actually aren’t that obvious.

Kevin Anthony 0:49
And today’s reason is actually not that obvious. At least it isn’t to most people. Now, something you and I actually talk about quite a lot. We’ve talked about this topic just between ourselves a lot. We’ve never really done a whole show on it. But when we were speaking with our guests, who we will introduce in just a moment, this topic came up again, and we were like…

Kevin Anthony 1:12
Oh yeah, this is something that we have personally talked about and seen a lot. And I think it’s time to address it on a show. So we are going to be doing that today. And hopefully, I have left you in suspense, wondering what that thing is by not telling you just yet.

Céline Remy 1:29
And the good thing is that this thing goes straight to the cause. So you’re not dealing with symptoms and putting little bandages trying to make it work and we’ll talk more about that you’re going to go to the cause of the root and you can eradicate it. Alright, before we introduce our guest today, let’s give a big shout-out to our sponsor’s power and mastery.

Céline Remy 1:49
So if you want to join the secret club of men who are great in bed, then check out power and mastery at power and mastery.com. It is the most complete sexual mastery training for men. Whether you want to have harder erections last longer or increase your sexual skills, there is something for you at power and mastery.com.

Céline Remy 2:12
So we have today Addy Medcalf, she is a relationship Maven, a psychologist, author, podcast host, TEDx speaker, who has helped 1000s of people think differently, so they can create connection, ease, and joy in their relationships, especially the one you have with yourself. And with her unique background in both business and counseling, she brings a fresh, effective perspective to life struggles, using humor and her direct no-nonsense style.

Céline Remy 2:41
She’s the author of the number one Amazon best-selling book, be happily married, even if your partner won’t do a thing. And we’ll come back to that because I’m sure many women want to hear about that. And she is also the host of the top-rated podcast relationship made easy. So welcome, Abby to the love lab podcast.

Abby Medcalf 3:01
Thank you for having me. I’m so excited to be here. It’s gonna be great.

Kevin Anthony 3:05
Well, that is a pretty impressive bio,

Céline Remy 3:08
and we cut some of her achievements off, but you can read that on the website. 40 minutes.

Abby Medcalf 3:16
Like my mother wrote that you know, it’s like goes on and on. Yeah.

Kevin Anthony 3:21
It’s great. I was that not making fun of that I was actually impressed by like, that’s pretty, pretty impressive. So those of you who are listening, be prepared for some amazing insights. So we’re just gonna jump right in? And the first question, but we’ll see how you answer.

Kevin Anthony 3:39
But I have some ideas myself on how you might answer it, which is when somebody comes to you, so a couple comes to you. And they’re seeking advice. There’s something not working in their relationship? What do they usually think the problem is?

Abby Medcalf 3:56
I would say, almost 100% of the time, people come to me and they say, the problem is communication. Of course, we need we don’t communicate, we need to improve our communication skills, and it happens pretty much every time. And then I have to tell them, they’re wrong.

Abby Medcalf 4:12
Well, it’s and they’re not wrong, you know, none of us are wrong. It’s true that our communication is failing, but failing because that’s actually a symptom of the problem, like we were talking about before. There’s actually a deeper problem, which is I can say it, I think, which is really, it’s competition in the relationship.

Abby Medcalf 4:30
We compete for time, resources, money, all the time in our relationships. And we’re really raised this way. It’s very kind of American Way, especially although I have clients all over the world, and it’s pretty common everywhere. But we compete with our partners not realizing that we’re doing it.

Kevin Anthony 4:47
Okay, so most just to sort of summarizing what you said, most people come in and I say it’s our communication and I have to say, honestly, you must have some pretty decent level clients. Because and I say that just because a lot of the people we work with think their communication is actually okay.

Kevin Anthony 5:06
They think that they’re communicating well, and we sit there, we’re like, You call that communication? Right? Like, we got it? Whoa, no, no, no, no, no, let’s take a few steps back here we got, we’ve got to address this communication piece. So they come in thinking that that’s the problem.

Kevin Anthony 5:25
And it likely is a problem. But I think, as you correctly pointed out, it’s also a symptom of a larger problem, which you have already told our audience is competition. So that, of course, begs question number three,

Céline Remy 5:42
what does it mean to be competing then in a relationship, because I’m sure when people hear the term, they’re like, I don’t compete. But I’m sure that and I can see it, like, in so many ways that we’ve been taught to behave like this. So in your opinion, Abby, like, what does it mean really to be competing in a relationship,

Abby Medcalf 5:54
It just, it shows up in just about everything, generally. So the obvious one I always use is people saying it’s your turn to put away the dishes, it’s your turn to do this thing we’re taking turns, really, is that where we are, we’re taking turns and relationships. So already, you’re keeping score, you’re merely keeping score, you’re saying, Oh, I did it the other day.

Abby Medcalf 6:24
So now it’s your turn. And you’d better be fair, and you’d better be exact, and it better be equitable. And that’s not true in any relationship, especially when you’re comparing time. Because we all have different capacities, we all have different things we do, we all have different things we bring to the table that are very valuable. And I will say that, for example, men get beat up on this one a lot.

Abby Medcalf 6:42
Because we know you know, the Pew Research Center, all the research that women physically do more work, when we get married, we live less long. People live as long as men, men live longer, and they get married men, men get your really great stuff and they get married, right. So that and that’s great. But there’s this idea somehow that men aren’t bringing to the table what women bring, and well, they’re not because they’re bringing something different.

Abby Medcalf 7:05
They’re bringing something just as valuable. But it really when you start breaking downtime and how many hours women spend and it’s true, right? And all the research will show you we spend more hours with childcare, we spend more hours cleaning the house, we spend more hours doing all the things. But that’s why you can’t compare in that way.

Abby Medcalf 7:21
And that’s why keeping score is so bad. So we start to if I’m doing this many hours of you know, I do all the cooking in my house and shopping and things that take more time, you know, then my, you know, Gary mowing the lawn, right? and stuff, like it just does. And but he does so many other things that are incredibly valuable to me. So when we start that’s why this competition thing is so bad.

Abby Medcalf 7:48
And so undermining. And I’ll tell you, for example, just really quickly, uh, my tires in my car were low. And I didn’t, he kept telling me, you know, you need air in your tires, right? They’re getting low. I come from New York City and have a car like I don’t, I don’t know, car cars aren’t my thing. I thought I had to go to the mechanic and leave it all day. I didn’t know it was an easy fix. I had no idea.

Abby Medcalf 8:09
So I kept ignoring it. To make a long story short, he went and did it for me. And he came home and I said all my I acted like he split the atom. Thank you, thank you. I’m so appreciative that you put this air in my tires. And he’s laughing saying it took me about two minutes. Right? So but it was the kit.

Abby Medcalf 8:29
And I said to him, I just he said, Well, I was thinking of how much how competent you are, and how together you are and you weren’t doing it. And so I thought, Oh, she doesn’t get how easy it is. I’ll just go take care of it. So even though that took him five minutes, how amazingly valuable is that in a relationship.

Abby Medcalf 8:47
So when you’re not keeping score, and you’re not adding up, you start to really come together and see each other’s really the wonderful things that we each bring to a relationship, right, which are very different.

Kevin Anthony 8:59
Yeah. And I like the way you put it. Because when you take it away from using the word competition and then use the words keeping score, it’s suddenly like, all of a sudden, it’s like, oh, now I get what she’s talking about, right? Because, you know, our, your when I started this show by saying that we talked about the fact that we witness a lot of people competing in relationships like it’s a much more modern phenomenon.

Kevin Anthony 9:28
Yeah, we can talk about that later. But we witness that alarm. And so we, we talk about a lot. But when we talk about it to other people, they don’t really get it. I don’t compete, you know, they just don’t understand what that means. So I think putting it in terms of keeping score keeping track of how many times did you do this? And how long did it take you to do that? Suddenly, people I think can get a real feel for what it means to be competing.

Kevin Anthony 9:54
And I just want to add one sort of example that maybe makes it I guess it makes it easier to understand, which is this. Let’s say you have a company. And you’ve got all these people in the company who have specific roles. This particular person is an engineer, this person is the bookkeeper or accountant. And this person is, you know, whatever.

Kevin Anthony 10:18
Would it make sense for you in a company to say, well, we need everything to be so equitable, that today it’s the accountant’s turn to do the engineering? Right? Would that make any sense whatsoever, of course not? Because you can have nothing about engineering, and they’re absolutely going to screw it up. And so I say, all the time, and Celine and I talked about this, it’s like, we’re a team. And we utilize our talents in the best way possible.

Kevin Anthony 10:47
So you know, I’m better at certain things, and she’s better at certain things. And so I handle the things where my skill set fits the best. And she handles the things where her skill set fits the best. And really, that just works so much better. We’ll talk about solutions later on.

Kevin Anthony 11:01
But I just think that’s a really good way of putting it, it’s like if people realize that, hey, wait a minute, not everybody’s great at every single job and asking people to do a bunch of things that aren’t really one their skill set, or two things that they even want to be doing. You know, like, the perfect example in our house is, she doesn’t like to, like, take the trash out.

Kevin Anthony 11:20
And she’s perfectly capable of, you know, taking care of the things in the outside the trash. And you know, that when the animals tear things up, and the gophers like, sure, she can do all that, but she doesn’t really want to, I, on the other hand, would prefer to do that over like vacuuming the house, you know, hey, sure, let me go outside, I’ll mess with the spiders and the dead animals and the dirty trash. And I’m fine with that. As long as I don’t have to get out the vacuum cleaner.

Abby Medcalf 11:50
Now, and I would even say that if both of you hated vacuuming, that you use a resource outside the couple. So what happens a lot in this competition thing, and this keeping score thing is that we, whenever something comes into the house that has to get done, and this is especially bad when you have kids, but it’s true all the time. So something Oh, the taxes have to get done. It’s time, right.

Abby Medcalf 12:12
And so we immediately look to the other person to our partner, okay, who’s gonna do it, we have the two of us who’s going to do it. And there’s this crate, you’ve got to understand that your shared resource. So if I drain my partner, I’m also draining myself every single time. And so it’s very important to really start thinking about bringing in resources from outside the couple.

Abby Medcalf 12:35
So and not always looking to your partnership to solve something or to do something. And or taking those things off your plate, if you can, if it’s something that doesn’t have to happen, you know, we used to have the kids and way too many activities. And at some point, you go, this isn’t helpful to our family, you know, this isn’t making us throw thriving, grow.

Abby Medcalf 12:55
You know, the kids don’t have to be in three sports and in a language and take an instrument and without, you know, you can let things go. But it’s, again, that keeping score thing comes up in also ways of you know, not being happy when our partners have success because we can sometimes see it, although be away from the house more now.

Abby Medcalf 13:12
They won’t be here, maybe we start getting jealous of co-workers or things like that. Maybe you are one of my other favorites is sometimes you know, our partners will come to us and say, Hey, man, I’m feeling neglected, maybe something like that? And the answer to that is oh my gosh, tell me more. That’s the only answer to that. Tell me more. But the answer is usually neglected.

Abby Medcalf 13:34
I did this, this, this, and this and this. And we list off all the things of why they shouldn’t feel that way. Because we’re keeping score. We are we’re This is that competition. This is what that looks like. And when I’m doing that, I don’t want you to win because I see it as a loss. For me. If you spend money on something, it means I don’t, it’s less for me, if you get you to know, promotion, and now you’re traveling a lot great.

Abby Medcalf 14:00
I’m stuck at home taking care of the kids. Wait, you know, there’s this constant like, and that’s a problem in a relationship, we want to really be there. We want our partners to win, we want them to have so much bounty because we’re a shared resource. So it means that I have that too. I get that too. It’s both of us.

Abby Medcalf 14:20
But again, and this is what really undermines this feeling of cooperation and partnership because I’m so busy watching what you’re doing and comparing it to what I’m doing. And I’m adding up the hours or the money you spent or whatever it is, and I’m comparing it and right there I am in just deficit. Right. And I will tell you that relates to one other piece, which is that and this is the work of Timothy Wilson.

Abby Medcalf 14:48
Our conscious brains process information at a rate of 50 bits per second, while our unconscious minds or subconscious processes information at a rate of 11 million bits per second. So, our partners don’t hear what we say they hear what we mean. So if I say, Oh, that’s great, I’m really happy about your promotion.

Abby Medcalf 15:10
But in the side, I am like, thinking of the 50 things I’m going to lose because of it and how annoying that is, and great, he’s gonna meet someone, now he’s off, or she’s gonna, you know, think she’s too good for me now, if that’s what I’m thinking, that’s what comes across. And we’ve all been there where someone was saying all the right things, but we didn’t believe them.

Abby Medcalf 15:29
And again, and that is undercutting your relationship also, that is starting to wear at the thread that holds us together, over and over and over, because we stopped trusting, we’re hearing this thing, but we don’t believe it. And that’s, that’s what’s getting under there all the time. Yeah, for

Kevin Anthony 15:48
sure. So you know, and you’ve answered it already. But I just want to kind of point it out a little bit more to the audience. Our next question was, why is the competition bad, and you just gave us like, 10 reasons why this competing, is really, really bad for your relationship. So I want people to really understand how negative some of those effects can be.

Kevin Anthony 16:09
And a man you really, you really hit on one with the money, which is if you buy something, that’s less money, for me, that is so huge relationships, and people don’t even realize that that’s underneath. They’re just like, I can’t believe you spent all that money, right? Or they’re like, whatever. If they really thought about it, they’d realize that what it is, is Yeah, because I wanted something myself, and now we don’t have the money for it, right? That’s underlying

Abby Medcalf 16:35
usually it or, you know, it’s worse, or I might want something. What if later,

Kevin Anthony 16:42
I need to have that pile there, just in case just

Abby Medcalf 16:45
in case, I want this. And again, here, my partner is so happy, so excited. My Gary does these Spartan races, you know, these things like an obstacle course, right world, but he’s very active anyway. And he does these races. And you know, we’re flying all over, we’re in East wherever, but fuck, you know, Montana, places, like I don’t want to be, you know, I’m a city girl.

Abby Medcalf 17:06
And we’re doing our thing. And but he, I’m a Gary FAN, you know, I’m not a fan of this thing. And I have this wonderful picture of him, they do a fire jump at the end, as they jump over a fire at the end of the thing. He is in such joy, my man is in such joy. So to watch him in that and to be in that. It’s amazing. So whatever money we spend whatever time I give up, quote, unquote, to go do these things.

Abby Medcalf 17:31
What, however, that all works, I’m getting, I’m getting super happy, fulfilled, you know, excited God, not to mention sick at our age, which is great. You know, what’s still sexy, and it looks great. You know, but you’re getting on. And again, we can miss that. Because I also could be on the thing of Oh my God, we spent all this money on these races.

Abby Medcalf 17:50
And you know, why are we doing it at this age, and I don’t want to go to these places. And oh, he’s probably going to meet women when he’s there who are really into it too. And I’m not into it, then what right? It’s so it would be so easy to just go the other way with it. And that’s the competition. And you have to decide, again, that you’re the shared resource. And that one of your happy anybody’s happiness is really giving you happiness, too.

Céline Remy 18:14
So I also think that it’s great to bring it I think the keeping score can show up in so many different areas of a relationship. So I would see it happening in the bedroom where, well, I’m the one who initiated or last time, or it’s always me doing this. And we always tell people, would you rather be the one who initiates and end up having sex or be grumpy and saying like, I’m not going to do it?

Céline Remy 18:39
Because it’s always me and get nothing. Right. Yeah. So I see keeping score with intimacy with how much kissing lovemaking or touches happening, who does what when I see keeping score with the money part, like how many people contribute. And I think it’s also a tricky one. Because with women working now, so and men working and the cost of life becoming higher, we each need to bring in more into a household to have the lifestyle we want.

Céline Remy 19:10
So we each contributing a lot. But sometimes if one makes x and the other one makes less, it’s not about we both put in this much amount. It’s like maybe we each put in x percentage or something like there are ways around that right. I see things about keeping score about the household very This is really big. And that’s one of the things that I want to come back to which is the title of your book with like,

Céline Remy 19:37
how can you still be happy while married or not in a relationship if your partner won’t do anything because right now I’m listing all these different areas within a relationship that people are keeping scores that are undermining that intimacy for the long run? Maybe there’s one more about keeping score about how many friends and how Many activities you go outside right and or have fun. You have

Abby Medcalf 20:04
plans them, oh, oh, I always have to plan the vacations. I always have to you know, whatever we’re going out. And to me, it comes back to what you were saying earlier. What are you good at? And I definitely hear the sex one a lot that what I just got it I people writing questions for me to I do like an ask Dr. Abby kind of thing, you know, and I get that a lot.

Abby Medcalf 20:25
What do I do if I’m always the one initiating because and be in the thing here is that we then decide what it means? It means he doesn’t desire me. If I’m always initiating and means he doesn’t desire me. And I always like to say to them, does it act like he’s not excited? Once you start having sex? Like, does he seem like he’s not interested?

Abby Medcalf 20:43
And of course, he’s very interested. It’s, it’s, you know, what are you bringing to the relationship, and sometimes as well, but in the beginning, he was always, you know, wanting to get on top of me. And now, I always have to initiate. And again, it’s like keeping scores. You’re so right on. And I think it sounds what you bring to the relationship? How wonderful How can you get even more creative around it? How can you have even more fun with it? What else can you do?

Abby Medcalf 21:09
And one of my favorite questions to tell people to ask when that stuff comes up is to ask their partner, what would you like to see more of in our sex life? It’s a perfect way because you know that, well, you’re not, you’re not doing this. And I, it gets us nowhere. And I say a lot, you know, we have to connect to correct. And so there has to be that connection. First, before we start talking about something that we don’t like, or that isn’t working for us.

Abby Medcalf 21:35
But there’s a lot of ways we don’t even have to talk about what’s not working, we can talk about what’s working and how to get more of it. So what would you like to see more of in our sex life? is such a great open question that what do I want to see more of Hmm. And in that, if they asked you, you can say I would you know, love it, if you don’t know, threw me on the kitchen table sometimes or whatever you whatever it is that you’d like to see more of.

Abby Medcalf 22:01
And don’t keep score with that. If that doesn’t happen later. So don’t be waiting, you know, ticking off Oh, I only we only had sex on the kitchen table twice. It’s, it’s not that at all, it’s about coming back to it over and over with this loving open heart about that we are in this together. And that is how you are happily in a relationship without your partner doing anything. It’s because you’re doing those things.

Abby Medcalf 22:27
And when you align that 50 bits and that 11 million bits when I am just in it. It is it’s contagious. It’s like being at a concert and everyone is on their feet, do you really think you’re going to be sitting in your seat? There’s you’re not you’re swept up. And that’s exactly what happens in a relationship. If you can be the dominant vibration. I hear all the time.

Abby Medcalf 22:51
Oh, I was in a great mood, and then my partner came home in a bad mood. And then I was upset. Why? How? Why didn’t it go the other way? Why is that the dominant thing that quote-unquote, wins? What are you talking about? So you need a dominant vibration, you be in that incredible, happy, abundant, sexy, whatever place you want to be in, just be in that it is like moths to a flame.

Abby Medcalf 23:17
Everyone is looking to connect to people I say a lot, you know, our partners are never looking for a way out. They’re looking for a way in. They’re always looking for that way and even if they’re threatening a way out. And so how do you let them in? You know, you have to be vulnerable and open and showing. But again, we keep score. Well, what if I do that? And they don’t, and they don’t? What if I What if I’m really loving and they’re not?

Céline Remy 23:42
Well, it’s kind of giving, we always talk about that giving without an agenda wherever you are in the bedroom or not. It’s like, if you give with the intention of getting, getting something in return, you are not truly giving. You are trying to convince yourself that I’m such a giver, and I’m like, Oh, really, you’re a taker. That’s all you’re doing. And that required quite a change to be willing. I read one day that the only love you get to keep is the one you give.

Céline Remy 24:10
And when I read that it made so much sense because, in my earlier years, I was kind of more of. If I’m loving this much. I’m going to mirror how much my partner’s like loving me, you know, and then and it’s very common because we’re like, well, we want to be in this equal relationship. But the day I decided it doesn’t matter whether or not my partner loves me as much as I do. I’m going to just love this person.

Céline Remy 24:39
And then once I did this, I guess I went to that place of surrender and letting go, and then I was finally able to see all the Million Ways that my partner loves me and appreciative that I thought maybe he loves me even more than I do incredible. How lucky am I like I was just like this is amazing and but it really took this awareness of myself and this letting go.

Céline Remy 25:05
And I think wherever it is around the love wherever it is around the money, the chores like being like, so what you know, and like, we have no more of this agenda behind that it has to go somewhere. That’s when the key the transformation happens.

Abby Medcalf 25:21
I agree. I, you know, I call that whole thing when we’re waiting for relationship gridlock. You know, I’m waiting for you to say it until I do it. Why initiate sex today. So now I’m waiting for you. So now we’re not having sex. You know, there’s all this gridlock and as in regular gridlock, someone has to move their car first. And I do say to people, you know, the one of the most pain needs to change first.

Abby Medcalf 25:45
If you’re the most pain, if you’re the one coming to me, because you’re upset, guess what, you’re the one who wants to change first. And as you do that, we see right, we start to see the world differently, our expectations, shift our perceptions shift, that’s what’s going on there. And then again, that 11,000,050 start to align in our partner structure really feel as they start to really get us and they start to act in kind.

Abby Medcalf 26:12
And that’s what happens unless you are with someone who truly has a very severe mental health disorder, which is maybe less than 3% of the population, I just want to say that so it’s very small you might be with a true narcissist, brittle narcissist, it’s possible, it’s just not probably, you know, it’s not as common we throw that word around a lot.

Abby Medcalf 26:34
So unless that’s true, then your partner, again, they’re looking for a way in, they will, they will gravitate towards that loving stance. And so you can’t be taken advantage of that’s what you know, I, if I heard a penny for every time I heard that, like, really, you’re, you’re, we’re worried that we’re loving too much.

Abby Medcalf 26:54
You know, as Mother Teresa worried about being taken advantage of, I don’t know what to say like being in the act of love is such a beautiful way to be, and we feel so happy and it feels replete. So we’re not thinking about other people taking advantage. And if you are thinking of that, you’re still keeping score. So I will say that that’s one of the little things you can have in your head to let you know that you’re still keeping score.

Kevin Anthony 27:16
Absolutely. I kind of want to, I mean, I actually want to dive down that rabbit hole a bit more. But there are so many other things to talk about. You want to do an ad for Yes, I

Céline Remy 27:27
wanted to do our ad, then we get back into this juicy conversation. So this is for all of you couples, who are stuck in a rut and just going through the daily motions, instead of connecting the way you used to, you might be tired of keeping scores of having stale sex and all of these things not feeling spontaneous like you know, there’s no more ease and connection in your relationship.

Céline Remy 27:48
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Kevin Anthony 28:14
Okay, so, you know, I said earlier on in the program that this is, in my opinion, more of a modern phenomenon, this idea of competition. And I think a lot of that it’s coming from society’s pressure where everything has to be equal. I don’t want to go too far into the feminism part. We did a whole show on that. But I think there’s a part of real feminism that gets confused, right?

Kevin Anthony 28:42
Because it’s like, yes, you should have the same rights to voting and you should have been able to make the same amount of money and have the same job opportunities. All that as far as being equal and equitable is fine. But I think it gets taken a bit too far. And then when it comes into the relationship, all of those are this is, you know, if I did the dishes this number of times you got to do them like that sort of equitable, not good.

Kevin Anthony 29:05
So the reason I’m bringing that up right now is that when you say that’s not good, and when you say you shouldn’t be doing that. And when you say give examples, for instance, like Well, I don’t really want to go here, but I’m his wife, so I want to support him. I want to sort of just nip this in the bud before anybody listening starts to get the wrong idea. It sounds like and honestly, it doesn’t to us, but it could potentially sound to other people.

Kevin Anthony 29:35
Like you’re advocating for traditional gender roles in relationships, which today would be a terrible thing to do. Oh my god, gender roles, this is horrible. But I wonder if you could talk about that a little bit more and maybe explain how even though it may seem like that, what you’re advocating that’s not actually what you’re advocating.

Abby Medcalf 29:58
Yeah. Mmm, it’s because I’m actually going deeper than that. So yeah, sometimes people can get that hit not so much anymore. But I remember when I’m first talking about this, what happened there on the top, it’s very easy to talk about emotional labor and things like that. I talked about all that on my podcast. So yes, women, as I said before we physically do more we do.

Abby Medcalf 30:25
And so there is a space of Oh, well, then, yeah, I just want that. No, I don’t. So what I do want is for people to really think about So number one, I would say, look outside your marriage to take care of a lot of these issues. Because as we said before, both people are often working now that used to not be the right outside and inside the home, all that.

Abby Medcalf 30:47
So this idea that we used to have, you know, whole communities raising children, whole communities, we didn’t do this on our own, not near relative Meirelles, I don’t have any relatives like living near me to take care of my kids, right, that didn’t exist. So, and up until literally like 50 years ago, that was always true. And we were forgetting, so we really can’t just do it us we do need to bring in other resources.

Abby Medcalf 31:12
I’m saying just don’t always look to your partner, because you’re both exhausted, you’re both so tired. And I also want to say that just like in a, you know, if you look at like a pride of lions, that’s what I always use, you know, those male lions have it made right there. They’re having sex and fighting off some hyenas occasionally, that’s pretty much in having their meals brought to them. You know, what we love to do? life’s pretty good, yet you cannot have a working pride without them.

Abby Medcalf 31:40
And what they contribute is no less valuable than what the lionesses contribute, right? Which you couldn’t have it without them either. Right? So, but this idea that one is more valuable than the other because of time, because of how much time goes into it. And what does happen is are things like, you know, as women, I can speak for myself, and my clients.

Abby Medcalf 32:03
I think a lot of people, we sometimes we want things a certain way, you know, we like things to be cleaned a certain way or to be put away a certain way or you know, and I had a couple of those the other day who she got really sick, he finished and he had worked all day. And she got really sick at dinner. And she said go to bed like my gosh, right? She comes down in the morning and there and he had cleaned up after dinner gotten the kids to but you know, he had done all the things.

Abby Medcalf 32:31
But there was the garbage that hadn’t been taken out. The counters weren’t completely wiped down, like nice right? There. Some of the dishes that have gotten cleaned, had some custom a little bit. And she was furious. She’s like, I had to wake up and do all this work when you know, he said he would take care of it. He didn’t really know how important this is to me. Right?

Abby Medcalf 32:51
He knows this reading minds thing is beautiful. And again, the definition that we give to things this and I said to her so what I made it really simple. I said if you just looked at the kitchen, and you had to give it a grade, and a plus to an F, what grade would you have given this kitchen when you walked in? What grade would you have given it? And she said, and she kind of savage because I guess felt like a B plus?

Kevin Anthony 33:18
I said and yet she is

Abby Medcalf 33:20
I know I and she got it. As soon as she said it, she got it. And I said what you’re feeling is somehow not taken care of in another way. And you’re talking about the kitchen. It’s not about the kitchen. It’s really about you know, I’m not with Gary because he mowed the lawn really well. That’s not why we get with people we get with them because of how they make us feel.

Abby Medcalf 33:41
I said you’re not feeling this way of your heart. You know, you were feeling vulnerable. You got sick, you were probably feeling guilty because women do God forbid we get sick, we have to go to bed and not do everything. You know you feel bad. That’s your stuff. So how can you ask for what you need?

Abby Medcalf 33:56
Yeah, I need a hug. I need a little extra love. I need you to let me know it’s so really is okay that you did all sexual work when I know how tired you are. She was feeling bad because he really did do all the things to kids, you know? And I said that’s your stuff. How do you How can you accept what he did do? And really think Wow, that’s so great. He put in such a great effort.

Kevin Anthony 34:19
Yeah. I think that’s a big key too. Right? Which is, he’s over there like, I am this shit, look. Yeah, I did. I got it all done. Like Boom, boom, boom, right? And then she comes down and complains and it completely burst his bubble because he’s like, I put so much energy into that. So I think from her point of view is Yeah, it’s absolutely not done to her standards.

Kevin Anthony 34:44
But the question is, did he give it his best effort? Did he really try? Did he really try hard? Because it is not stuff that he does every day. Normally probably a lot of it. Right, But did he do his best and try his best to help the kids. And I think that’s really a key place that she needs to be coming from is like she needs to look at and go, okay, it’s not perfect. It’s not the way I would have done it. But did he really like to try hard to help me out here? And if the answer is yes, then you just got to love it. Love him for it, you know?

Abby Medcalf 35:16
Well, and it might not look good, he try-hard. He’s doing his best might have even been a D in that kitchen. Right? But he’s but to assume that he was still doing his best. We all have different capacities, I can get a lot of crap done. I gotta tell you, I’m like most people can’t get done when I get done.

Abby Medcalf 35:35
So but to compare others to what I can do in that amount of time is not fair. It’s not. It’s just not their capacity. It’s just not what’s important to them. It’s not what they see. Right? But Gary cleans the bathroom and leaves it full of garbage. It’s like what he really did like he just missed, I don’t know, you know, it wasn’t on purpose. I don’t want to leave that there. Screw her. That’s not what’s happening. The

Kevin Anthony 35:58
the task was to clean that sink in that toilet. Probably got done really well,

Abby Medcalf 36:04
really well. Of course, didn’t you know, I got a cleaning lady. Let’s be real. But you know, every now and then you need some extra help. Right? But do you? Right? Like there’s a way of just really understanding that I had another couple, you know, she comes down in the morning, and he does the dishes at night. And he didn’t do them. Like they were still there.

Abby Medcalf 36:22
And she hates coming in which I understand she’s got two little kids, she comes down in the morning. It’s her shift, you know, and the kitchens a mess. And she’s starting from there. And she’s furious. And she’s upstairs yelling and like what you know, and I. And it’s not about that you don’t want him to do it. I mean, really, it’s about understanding that he wasn’t trying to piss her off. I mean, that’s the last thing on men’s minds general pissing off their women, I will tell you that right now.

Abby Medcalf 36:50
They are trying everything they can not to. But he was so done and so burnt, he really couldn’t do it. And what and it still needs to get done now and see that’s where it can seem very like roles. And women just have to suck it up or something. And it’s not at all I just want that solve for the future. So I said to her instead, can you go up to him, he’s laying in bed, right? And say, I need us to figure this out. I need us to figure out how we’re going to get the kitchen clean.

Abby Medcalf 37:19
Because I can’t come down in the morning like that. And I get you, I don’t know how you just couldn’t do less I get it because I know you’re trying your butt like you’re trying your best. So what can we do? How can we problem-solve this, as a team. So it’s not something that continues to happen. That’s the difference. And you might end up with help in the mornings when you thought that was a weird, crazy thing.

Abby Medcalf 37:41
You might end up I don’t even know what you might do. But something else so that you’re not just again, keeping score blaming the other person or being a martyr, and just like, oh, I just have to do this because no one else will do it. I don’t want that either. I just want all of us to get together.

Kevin Anthony 37:57
There are always solutions for this stuff. I do this in our relationship all the time when I sense that she’s starting to get a little too overwhelmed with the number of tasks that have to go have to get done. I say, Okay, we got to do two things. Number one, we got to prioritize what’s really important, and what can we let go? Number two, we got to figure out a system for taking care of the thing that actually has to get done. And there are tons and tons of different ways.

Kevin Anthony 38:24
If you think outside the box dishes, okay, can you hire somebody to come in and do dishes? Can you get a new dishwasher where you can actually put half of that stuff in because your old one you can’t put half that stuff in or whatever? There are tons of ways around that to solve those problems.

Kevin Anthony 38:37
And honestly, as guys, no I’m not saying women aren’t good problem solvers, because they are. But as guys, that’s like usually one thing, we’re really good at solving problems. We’re very task-oriented, you give us a problem, we will figure out a way to solve it,

Abby Medcalf 38:54
like to solve a problem. No, it’s really just that we approach and not you versus me approach. And again, not always thinking everything has to happen within the couple. It just can’t again, we have whole families and communities and extended families doing half the stuff that gets done right now. It is not possible. My biggest running joke is Oprah doesn’t even have it all.

Abby Medcalf 39:22
If friggin Oprah, like who’s like superhuman, can’t have it all shouldn’t have kids. She’s not married, she’s struggling with her weight. She can’t have it all. She’s a billionaire. I love her. But she doesn’t have it like, this doesn’t exist this dream, whatever doesn’t exist and you make decisions that work for your life. She certainly seems very happy god bless her.

Abby Medcalf 39:48
I’m happy for her. You know, it’s great. It’s just at some point she made decisions about what was the most important thing and, and is very happy with them clearly and we have to do that in our relationship. That’s the most important thing is the relationship. Do you think it’s hard right now doing the dishes when he’s sleeping? Try when you’re divorced.

Abby Medcalf 40:08
Try doing that when you have two households have these kids, you know, it’s an beyond that it’s just you being unhappy all the time isn’t what I want for you. I love you. What are you doing here? How do we shift this, again from accepting help to really asking in a new way, if you didn’t get the help before, don’t give up at our jobs? You know, if I’m doing something that I can’t I work at corporations

Abby Medcalf 40:30
Still, if I’m, you know, tasked with something at a company, and I’m not getting it done right away, I don’t go Oh, well, you don’t need to pay me anyway. But I didn’t do this by eye, right. We go, oh, how else can we do this? What are the resources we have to bring in? Let’s call Bob from accounting, let’s, you know, we think of we really think of all the things because it has to get done?

Abby Medcalf 40:50
Well, your relationship absolutely needs to be happy and joyous and sexy and luscious, and yummy and great. So how do we keep moving towards that place over and over, you know, keep recommitting to that over and over?

Céline Remy 41:06
So this is a good segue into giving a few tips to our listeners. Because I think we talked a lot of bots in how competition and keeping score shows up. I think everyone listening was able to recognize themselves at some point or another. I sure have. And so where do we go from there?

Céline Remy 41:27
What are some of the strategies that people can do? Well, you’ve already said about being a team getting the outside help, like you don’t have to do everything as a couple. But do you have anything else maybe as a first step that they could take?

Abby Medcalf 41:44
I there are a few. So that one is, you know, make it a first goal to get outside resources or take things off the plate, think of what doesn’t have to happen, right? That that those are the kind of bigger strategic things. But the internal emotional things are to start to have. This is this kind of paradigm shift of being a shared resource, that whenever I’m looking at my partner for something, I’m actually taking it away from myself too.

Abby Medcalf 42:12
So how do I you know, really start to think of us as on the same team right over and over. And one of the little things I talk about a lot to help that conversation is not to sack not best AC doesn’t offer suggestions, give advice or criticize, so ever. So, and of course, people are like, well, what’s left? And it’s asking questions and asking good ones, what and good ones meaning not why questions, but like what the sex life thing we talked about earlier?

Abby Medcalf 42:46
I could go to my husband say, oh, why aren’t you initiating sex? And I really need that. And I’ve asked five times for this and you’d ever do it, right? That is just not going to get you anywhere you want to go. But to think like, hey, what would you like to see more of in your sex life in our sex life?

Abby Medcalf 43:01
Now I’m going to get to that I’m just coming around it a little differently. I’m getting us on the same team first, and then going somewhere, and really getting rid of any idea of negotiation, I really hate the idea. I’m over here, you’re over here, we’re on the substrate line. And we’re negotiating. And we know from the research that when people negotiate, both sides think they gave up more. This you know, so talk about your competition, and you’re keeping score.

Abby Medcalf 43:32
So now I think so I gave this in there, we both think we lost, which is terrible because again, we can’t have winners and losers. So I talked a lot about this paradigm of a triangle instead. And we’re both here and there’s a solution out there that neither of us has. And together we need to brainstorm to figure out what that is, right? And I always want you thinking that way I don’t have to figure this out.

Abby Medcalf 43:55
We are going to figure this out. We are going to do that just continue to have it that way. And it’s I know for me because I’m a superwoman and I suck at asking for help and I immediately go to just problem solving and fixing things that have been the biggest shift I’ve had to make is not just jumping in with what the solution already is, but actually asking and I’m surprised sometimes what this because it isn’t something I thought you’d ever go for.

Abby Medcalf 44:25
Alright isn’t something I thought he’d ever come up with or that we would or something I never even thought of it over and over again. And when we come to our partners like that the vulnerability is there. We develop trust. The communication starts which again now goes into the bedroom now goes into our parenting now goes to me goes everywhere.

Abby Medcalf 44:44
It’s amazing. But if you just started with not trying this for even a day or a week to not sack not offer suggestions, giving advice or criticizing and instead only asking questions when something doesn’t feel right or we’re trying to get something to move just Ask questions and I’m telling you your relationship will transform.

Kevin Anthony 45:03
Yeah, it’s absolutely fantastic advice. You know, in, in our relationship, we kind of very early on coined the term team us, right? Because we have always, from the beginning, viewed our relationship as a team. Like we’re working together for a common goal all the time.

Kevin Anthony 45:23
And I think that’s where a lot of relationships fail is they see themselves as opposites opposing each other a lot of the time, how can I get my needs met at the expense of the other one? So yeah, fantastic advice. Yes. So

Céline Remy 45:37
where can people find more of you? I know you’ve got books, and your website, so please tell our listeners where they can connect with you.

Abby Medcalf 45:48
The website has everything. It’s Abby Metcalf calm ABV, y me dcalf.com. And there is a free communication toolkit for couples on there. Because you know, I have to speak the language of the people. And so it’s really popular and really will be helpful. And then and the podcast is there.

Abby Medcalf 46:09
All the things, the books, there’s a lot of free things, too. There’s a learned optimism workshop, there’s a mindfulness starter kit, meditation starter kits, all they are free. I like to have things accessible to everyone. So you can get you can buy things there. But you can also get lots of good free resources.

Céline Remy 46:25
Awesome. And we come to a very last question, Abby, tell our listener, what is your best sexual talent?

Abby Medcalf 46:34
I think I thought of this because I’m like, Oh, they asked this question. I have to think I asked Gary’s been listed. Of course, I did. I said to Gary, I saw I saw I asked Gary and he said, blowjobs, so I’m gonna have to go with that. I asked him, I was like, What is it? He said a lot of jobs all day long. I said, great.

Kevin Anthony 46:52
That’s a great skill to have.

Abby Medcalf 46:54
It’s a great skill to have. It’s fun for everybody.

Kevin Anthony 46:59
Absolutely.

Céline Remy 47:00
I would agree with that one. Well, you have a lucky husband, and you’re a lucky woman too. Because blowjobs are fun, but

Abby Medcalf 47:07
they are fun. That’s a win-win.

Kevin Anthony 47:12
Yeah, you know, if you’re lucky enough to be in a relationship with a woman who really loves to give blowjobs definitely don’t take it for granted. You know, because it’s amazing. A lot of guys I have Wish I could get my woman to give me more blowjobs it’s like, the other night and he was like, give me your cock. I’m like, are you sure and kind of tired. Like, don’t you just want to go to bed? She’s like, No, I want it right now. Okay.

Abby Medcalf 47:39
Cuz I love you. A little bit of a joke we have He’s like, Okay. Well, yeah, I was, I was happy to know that. I was like, I have to ask him.

Céline Remy 47:52
You are the very first guest who has listened probably to an entire show to the end because we never know. They are always very surprised. So you came prepared. Good job.

Abby Medcalf 48:01
I was ready.

Céline Remy 48:03
I was ready.

Kevin Anthony 48:06
All right. Well, that interview just flew by. We are actually over time, but it was great. We didn’t ask half the questions we wrote down. But it was fantastic. And I really think that the audience got a lot of value. So thank you so much for being on the show today.

Abby Medcalf 48:21
Thank you for having me. It was awesome. I love talking. I can talk to you guys all day. Same here.

Kevin Anthony 48:28
All right, everybody. That’s all the time we have for this episode. And we will see you next week. We hope you like this episode of the love lab podcast. If you enjoy this show, subscribe. leave us a review and share it with your friends.

Céline Remy 48:45
And for more free exclusive content. Join us in the passion vault at kevinanthonycoaching.com/vault.

Kevin Anthony 48:59
Thanks for listening. And remember,

Céline Remy 49:01
you’re amazing